Episode 5

full
Published on:

5th Jan 2022

Building Self Confidence

Creating art is a vulnerable practice that exposes artists to judgment on a regular basis, and it can be incredibly difficult to maintain healthy self-esteem. In this episode of Morning Walk with The Artist's Forge, you'll hear how a group of artists and business people manage their own confidence and how they build their self-worth through habits, thought patterns, and mindful practice.

Transcript
Matt Stagliano:

Hi, this is Matt Stagliano and thanks for being

Matt Stagliano:

part of the artists Forge. We're a community of creatives who

Matt Stagliano:

help each other think like an artist. By discussing creativity

Matt Stagliano:

as a process instead of a skill or a talent. We believe everyone

Matt Stagliano:

has what it takes to create something amazing. We just need

Matt Stagliano:

some encouragement and inspiration along the way. What

Matt Stagliano:

you're about to hear is a live recording of one of our daily

Matt Stagliano:

discussions on the clubhouse app. If you like what you hear,

Matt Stagliano:

I encourage you to join our private Facebook group, or visit

Matt Stagliano:

us on the web at the artist forged calm. Now on to the show.

Nicole York:

And I'm super glad to have you back with us. This

Nicole York:

brighten early Monday morning for morning walk, and photo talk

Nicole York:

with the artist Forge. As you can see, we have our lovely

Nicole York:

moderators with us this morning, the amazing and ultra talented

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beside Matt Becca, and the lovely cat. And now you know

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you're here with us. And I'm really glad you are because

Nicole York:

today we're gonna be talking about building self confidence.

Nicole York:

And I know that this is one of those conversations, I

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personally need to have multiple times in my life, maybe every

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couple months is good, just to remind me of the things that I

Nicole York:

can do. Kick me in the butt a little bit. And also take away

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any guilt or shame that I might feel

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as a result of not always being where I wish I was, and how that

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can have a damper on my self confidence. So that's the

Nicole York:

conversation today you're building self confidence as an

Nicole York:

artist, as a creator, as a business person as a you. So

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wherever you identify with needing this conversation most,

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or with being the most competent. That's where I'd love

Nicole York:

to hear from you. Because I have lots of thoughts on this issue.

Nicole York:

But first, I want to know, when it comes to self confidence,

Nicole York:

what do you all think is the most important thing? And how do

Nicole York:

you manage your own self confidence

Cat Ford-Coates:

so it's interesting self confidence, for

Cat Ford-Coates:

me was actually something I learned to feign pretty well, as

Cat Ford-Coates:

a kid.

Cat Ford-Coates:

I was bullied a lot for a really long time until probably like my

Cat Ford-Coates:

sophomore year in high school. And like a lot by the same group

Cat Ford-Coates:

of people and like over and over again, love a lot. And as I

Cat Ford-Coates:

might my physically grew, I realized that I was taller and

Cat Ford-Coates:

larger than most of the people my age. And if I pretended to be

Cat Ford-Coates:

strong and relatively like unapproachable, it gave me a

Cat Ford-Coates:

little more distance between the bullying and my physical person.

Cat Ford-Coates:

And that, you know, definitely grew into your intimidating,

Cat Ford-Coates:

like, I'm not intimidating, I'm just quiet and tall. But it as

Cat Ford-Coates:

an adult, like that carried through into things and I had to

Cat Ford-Coates:

sort of relearn how to be approachable and outwardly kind

Cat Ford-Coates:

and that kind of thing. But actual self confidence where I

Cat Ford-Coates:

was able to sort of step into actually feeling strong and

Cat Ford-Coates:

confident for lack of a better term. It was in accomplishment

Cat Ford-Coates:

and connection. And from a business standpoint, you know,

Cat Ford-Coates:

like I went to school for sound engineering, I didn't go to

Cat Ford-Coates:

school for photography. And in that like starting to work on

Cat Ford-Coates:

accreditation and allowing myself opportunity to, to grow

Cat Ford-Coates:

in my craft beyond the sales dollar, but actually start to

Cat Ford-Coates:

master my tools and my process and my systems has allowed me to

Cat Ford-Coates:

sort of gain some recognition there. And in that recognition

Cat Ford-Coates:

feel accomplished, whether it's through awards or hitting sales

Cat Ford-Coates:

goals or you know, insert thing here allowed me to grow my

Cat Ford-Coates:

actual confidence versus my faint confidence as a as a

Cat Ford-Coates:

shield.

Nicole York:

because often when we have this conversation around

Nicole York:

self confidence, there's there can be a lot of talk around And

Nicole York:

just, you know, saying things to yourself, right like I am this

Nicole York:

and I am this. And that's fantastic. I totally think that

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one of the big things we have to do is change our internal

Nicole York:

narratives. And we'll talk about that later. But the thing that

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you said about becoming competent, right, and having

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these accomplishments just increases your credibility with

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yourself. And that's something we don't always talk about a

Nicole York:

lot. But it's really important, because confidence means belief

Nicole York:

in the ability to do what you say. And that's what credit is,

Nicole York:

right? Like when you when you start to build your competence,

Nicole York:

and you start to do things that prove your confidence back to

Nicole York:

yourself, then you're building credibility, then you know, that

Nicole York:

you can do the things that you say you're going to do. And it's

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not just a kind of nebulous feeling of like, I'm, I know

Nicole York:

that I can do the thing, which is important to have. But it's

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the proof, you have the proof there that says, hey, you can do

Nicole York:

the thing. And that's a really, really important thing to have.

Nicole York:

And it's not. It's not always easy to build, because you have

Nicole York:

to do the entire process of gaining the skill and repeating

Nicole York:

the skill. And using that in practical ways, and then being

Nicole York:

able to see the returns come back to you. And so that whole

Nicole York:

thing is a journey. And people oftentimes will get disheartened

Nicole York:

on that path. And so they end up in this place of being the

Nicole York:

person who says, I wish I could, uh, you're so talented, I could

Nicole York:

never be that way, etc, etc, when really all that happened is

Nicole York:

they never stayed on the path long enough to build the skill,

Nicole York:

that credibility then returned to them in the form of

Nicole York:

accomplishment. And man, oftentimes, all it takes is just

Nicole York:

staying on the path long enough to start to see those returns.

Nicole York:

So what kept you going before you started to have some of

Nicole York:

those accomplishments that were like proof of concept?

Cat Ford-Coates:

My inability to give attention to anything else.

Cat Ford-Coates:

Um, I mean, that's only half joking. I've, I think I've

Cat Ford-Coates:

talked about in this room a few times, you know, when I, I

Cat Ford-Coates:

started my photo business the same time I started another

Cat Ford-Coates:

business that's like a brewery. And I was working like 90 to 100

Cat Ford-Coates:

hours a week, between the two and not executing either. Well,

Cat Ford-Coates:

the socket was great, we received a lot of accolades, but

Cat Ford-Coates:

we were severely underfunded. And there was just some there,

Cat Ford-Coates:

there were many factors. But when we close the brewery, it

Cat Ford-Coates:

was a matter of okay, now you don't have any more excuses.

Cat Ford-Coates:

Now, you can only focus on one thing. So you can go get a job

Cat Ford-Coates:

job. Which I did, I think I had four or you can go get another

Cat Ford-Coates:

job job and just stay there. And I didn't want to do that. I

Cat Ford-Coates:

didn't want to work for somebody else building somebody else's

Cat Ford-Coates:

second home and building somebody else's dreams and

Cat Ford-Coates:

building up somebody else's tuition for their their kids.

Cat Ford-Coates:

And so I said, Okay, if you're going to do it, then you have to

Cat Ford-Coates:

go all in. And it was in betting on myself and my ability to go

Cat Ford-Coates:

all in you know, even if I wasn't very good, because I

Cat Ford-Coates:

wasn't. But I figured out how to build the business somewhat

Cat Ford-Coates:

sustainably from a price point standpoint. And I just went

Cat Ford-Coates:

after it. And about three years later, my work got kind of

Cat Ford-Coates:

decent, and but I was still making money through the whole

Cat Ford-Coates:

thing. And it was my ability to do ask for that sale and be

Cat Ford-Coates:

compensated for my half great work at you know, a standard

Cat Ford-Coates:

that was probably out of reach for the quality I was producing,

Cat Ford-Coates:

but at the same time it allowed me to, to practice and do the

Cat Ford-Coates:

thing over and over and over again. To get better

Nicole York:

i i just had a lot of feelings there. When you're

Nicole York:

talking about basically the fact that you really didn't give

Nicole York:

yourself another choice, did you? I mean, I know that there

Nicole York:

was the potential of, you know, going and getting a real, quote

Nicole York:

unquote, like job job, right, where you're working for

Nicole York:

somebody else and having that steady income. But you didn't. I

Nicole York:

mean, I know from talking to you that that was, in a way, kind of

Nicole York:

not an option, you did not want to be that person, right. And so

Nicole York:

in a real way, you you kind of jumped without a safety net,

Nicole York:

didn't you? Always do? Yes. And I think that says so much.

Nicole York:

Number one, when you take that leap, you're counting on your

Nicole York:

wings to show up on the way down, and there is almost

Nicole York:

nothing that will build your confidence in your ability to do

Nicole York:

hard things, more than doing something hard without a

Nicole York:

fallback plan, because you either succeed, or you're going

Nicole York:

to learn a lot through pain. And both of those things are going

Nicole York:

to give you self confidence. And that credence in a way that you

Nicole York:

can't get through anything else. If you walk out onto a ropes

Nicole York:

course. And you are tied up, and you've got all of these, you

Nicole York:

know, ropes on you, you can still go through the course it's

Nicole York:

still scary as hell, and you're still going to earn credibility

Nicole York:

with yourself from being able to step out and do that thing. But

Nicole York:

stepping out without any safety net without a rope tied to you,

Nicole York:

teaches you things about yourself that you're never going

Nicole York:

to learn any other way. And it's not always the best first step

Nicole York:

for everybody. Like you said, like, up until that point, you

Nicole York:

had tried and failed at some things, you would had other

Nicole York:

jobs, you'd run other businesses, you knew kind of

Nicole York:

what it was like to step out. And so taking this leap kind of

Nicole York:

seems like it became a natural extension of the leaps that you

Nicole York:

had taken before.

Cat Ford-Coates:

There's a saying in the fitness community,

Cat Ford-Coates:

primary primarily in CrossFit, that but did you die? Right. You

Cat Ford-Coates:

know, like, it didn't tell me did it hurt? Yeah, shit and hurt

Cat Ford-Coates:

a lot. But I held on to that thing, right? That when I was in

Cat Ford-Coates:

college in 1997, and in a dark room for hours at a time,

Cat Ford-Coates:

thinking, Man, this would be cool to do. This would be really

Cat Ford-Coates:

cool to do for a living. I just don't know how to do it. So I'm

Cat Ford-Coates:

just gonna go about my life, right, and I got a job at Pizza

Cat Ford-Coates:

Hut and, you know, life went on. But now I'd found a way to do it

Cat Ford-Coates:

as a business and for a living. So I just had to learn to do the

Cat Ford-Coates:

thing. And, you know, here we are.

Nicole York:

Yeah, it's funny to take, you know, such an amazing

Nicole York:

life and condense it all of a sudden, and go and now, you

Nicole York:

know, here we are, like, we live our own lives, it's so easy to

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look back and say, you know, okay, well, here's the logic of

Nicole York:

A to B to C to D, and how I got there. But when you get to hear

Nicole York:

it from the outside perspective, you get to, you know, partake in

Nicole York:

that story and be like, You are one bad bitch.

Cat Ford-Coates:

I'm something else we'll call it that.

Nicole York:

Yes, I love that. Okay, so what, for me what I

Nicole York:

really take away, and I'm so glad that you got to tell your

Nicole York:

story, because it touches on a lot of the things that I really

Nicole York:

wanted to make sure that we covered. And two of those really

Nicole York:

big things being the fact that self confidence without

Nicole York:

credibility is a mirage, right? It is something we can say and

Nicole York:

repeat to ourselves many times, and it often may give us the

Nicole York:

courage to step out into the thing. So I think it's still

Nicole York:

can't be overstated how important it is that we control

Nicole York:

our internal narrative. But at some point, we need to see

Nicole York:

returns from those actions in order for the credibility to

Nicole York:

actually mean something you can believe it, because that's kind

Nicole York:

of you know, the heart of the term. And confidence comes from

Nicole York:

the fact that you know, you can trust yourself to do the thing,

Nicole York:

and to get the results that you need. And so as much as as much

Nicole York:

as controlling that narrative is important. And that's definitely

Nicole York:

something that we're gonna get deep into, because it's kind of

Nicole York:

the seed, right? Like it's the beginning. And it really doesn't

Nicole York:

matter so much. If the initial stages are not necessarily true,

Nicole York:

right? Like you said, you had to kind of fake your way into a

Nicole York:

semblance of confidence at first. And so many of us do so

Nicole York:

many times, we just have to talk ourselves into saying the thing

Nicole York:

to ourselves for a little bit. And soon, some of the actions

Nicole York:

and some of the feelings that are related to what we say to

Nicole York:

ourselves start to show up. But eventually, if we don't have the

Nicole York:

proof in the pudding to back up those thoughts that we have, we

Nicole York:

can't maintain telling ourselves that we can't maintain lying

Nicole York:

ourselves, or lying to ourselves is what it feels like right over

Nicole York:

and over again, if something doesn't show up to tell us hey,

Nicole York:

it's true. Look, look, look at the proof. So thank you so much

Nicole York:

for sharing that I think it's such an important thing for us

Nicole York:

to know, as artists that we need to be paying attention to when

Nicole York:

we start getting those returns, and they don't have to be big at

Nicole York:

first. It can be our first small client in our first crappy

Nicole York:

painting or photo, who loves it, and oh, my God, we aren't the

Nicole York:

only ones. And that little tiny bit of proof can sustain us

Nicole York:

through the next hard part where we struggled to earn the rest of

Nicole York:

those skills or, you know, to make that next sale or whatever

Nicole York:

it is. So it is a big deal, folks. Matt, Bassam, Bekka any

Nicole York:

thoughts on how we build our self confidence? What do you

Nicole York:

think is important about this process? Or what do you do that

Nicole York:

is successful for you? Well,

Bassam Sabbagh:

I can it's up to you. Anyways. Yeah, myself. I

Bassam Sabbagh:

mean, I'm I'm consider myself quite self confident. And most

Bassam Sabbagh:

of the things I do and I think it comes back from what you

Bassam Sabbagh:

said, it's the the continual continuous auto feedback of

Bassam Sabbagh:

accomplishments, many accomplishments, and it started

Bassam Sabbagh:

way back. I think it comes back to my academics. Where as a

Bassam Sabbagh:

young as a young kid, I It's not that I excelled in school, I

Bassam Sabbagh:

wasn't like a, you know, straight A student 9598,

Bassam Sabbagh:

average, things like that. But I always did well, and I did well

Bassam Sabbagh:

without working very hard. Right. And that means I didn't

Bassam Sabbagh:

study a lot. And as I and I would do well, and I figured out

Bassam Sabbagh:

that what what I did well is have the curiosity to understand

Bassam Sabbagh:

the subject, I listened, I absorbed I processed

Bassam Sabbagh:

information. And I understood this subject. And a lot of

Bassam Sabbagh:

people do that. But a lot of people can't do that a lot of

Bassam Sabbagh:

people would memorize things, especially when it comes to

Bassam Sabbagh:

things like mathematics and sciences, they'd memorize

Bassam Sabbagh:

formulas and and you can't, you can't win at maths by just

Bassam Sabbagh:

memorizing things, eventually, you're going to get caught. So I

Bassam Sabbagh:

would take the extra step to try to understand and I was the type

Bassam Sabbagh:

of guy that would study at night, people would be up till

Bassam Sabbagh:

three or four in the morning studying for an exam, I would

Bassam Sabbagh:

stop at 11 and say, That's it, I'll figure it out on the test

Bassam Sabbagh:

during the test. And I think it comes down to just having that

Bassam Sabbagh:

curiosity and that analytical mind to understand things

Bassam Sabbagh:

fundamentally, which put me in a position that I can stand on my

Bassam Sabbagh:

feet, I can figure things out on the spot. And I know I will

Bassam Sabbagh:

succeed. I think that's the accumulation of, of auto

Bassam Sabbagh:

feedback that I got. And I also come to think of it had have had

Bassam Sabbagh:

and probably still have a need to fit in, not to stand out.

Bassam Sabbagh:

Alright, I was I was born in Lebanon, and I came to my family

Bassam Sabbagh:

came to Canada, I was 14 years old. So that was like 45 years

Bassam Sabbagh:

ago. And, and I needed to fit in, I did not want to be the guy

Bassam Sabbagh:

that stands out that looks different. That sounds different

Bassam Sabbagh:

that so so by by just having that need to fit in, and that

Bassam Sabbagh:

was just an example of how I want to fit, I want to fit in

Bassam Sabbagh:

professionally, I want to fit in with my job I want to fit in as

Bassam Sabbagh:

a photographer. It again, it drove me to dig for those

Bassam Sabbagh:

nuances. I always talk about being able to understand the

Bassam Sabbagh:

30,000 foot level, but know exactly when to go deep down and

Bassam Sabbagh:

figure out the details that make a difference. And I think

Bassam Sabbagh:

practicing that and living that and doing that throughout my

Bassam Sabbagh:

career. And whether it's in business or photography is what

Bassam Sabbagh:

gives me the confidence that you know what, I'll figure it out.

Bassam Sabbagh:

It'll happen. It'll be more than good enough. And I'm fine with

Bassam Sabbagh:

that.

Nicole York:

You know, but some what you were just talking about

Nicole York:

there, really touched on the fact that where we placed the

Nicole York:

heart of our confidence is really important, right? So you

Nicole York:

weren't confident in the fact that you were the smartest kid

Nicole York:

in the room. You weren't confident in the fact that you

Nicole York:

could never fail or anything else you were confident in the

Nicole York:

fact that you were curious enough to learn something

Nicole York:

deeply. And it's really amazing when we think about how, where

Nicole York:

we decide to place our confidence and I say decide

Nicole York:

Because as we get older, we need to recognize that who we build

Nicole York:

for ourselves, a person we build as ourselves is something we can

Nicole York:

control. When we're younger, we don't have a whole lot of, we

Nicole York:

don't have a whole lot of practical knowledge about how we

Nicole York:

are becoming the person we're becoming, we're mostly just in

Nicole York:

the experience. But as we get a little bit older, we're able to

Nicole York:

recognize the fact that where we choose to put our confidence is

Nicole York:

going to determine how successful that competence

Nicole York:

actually becomes for us whether it actually leads to results.

Nicole York:

And if you place your confidence in the fact that you are the

Nicole York:

smartest person in the room, eventually somebody is going to

Nicole York:

show up in your life, who's going to shatter your confidence

Nicole York:

and yourself. If you put your confidence in the fact that you

Nicole York:

are the best photographer in the business, eventually, you're

Nicole York:

going to come across a photographer who shatters that

Nicole York:

vision you have of yourself in your head, and all of a sudden,

Nicole York:

your confidence is going to take a hit that it might not be able

Nicole York:

to recover from and having confidence in the fact that

Nicole York:

you're curious enough to learn something deeply. That is an

Nicole York:

almost unshakable center, right? Like, nobody can come at you for

Nicole York:

that. If you are curious, that's something you can maintain

Nicole York:

during your entire life in almost any circumstance. And

Nicole York:

saying, I'm willing to learn this thing deeply. I'm curious

Nicole York:

enough, that I can do the deep dive into these things, that is

Nicole York:

a center of confidence that really can't be shaken. So it's

Nicole York:

pretty amazing that you were able to recognize that about

Nicole York:

yourself. Because like you said, you know, you've been able to

Nicole York:

maintain that confidence in yourself for for pretty much

Nicole York:

your entire career. So that's a really kind of amazing testament

Nicole York:

to the fact that placing our confidence in a thing that is

Nicole York:

not easily broken, is a pretty big deal.

Bassam Sabbagh:

You know, it's absolutely amazing what you just

Bassam Sabbagh:

said, because I never thought of it that way. But that that is a

Bassam Sabbagh:

brilliant way of looking of looking at and trying to see

Bassam Sabbagh:

where people are coming from is where do they place their

Bassam Sabbagh:

confidence on I am going to remember that and use it and

Bassam Sabbagh:

many, many things I do especially coaching. But but the

Bassam Sabbagh:

thing that the other thing about that when you put your

Bassam Sabbagh:

confidence in something that's internal to you that you own,

Bassam Sabbagh:

and nobody else does, and nobody else can impact. It's a

Bassam Sabbagh:

transferable skill. Right? It really is, it's yours, you can

Bassam Sabbagh:

take it anywhere you want, you can take it into into you know,

Bassam Sabbagh:

basket weaving, and you can take it into photography, you can

Bassam Sabbagh:

take it into becoming a CEO of a company is the same. Same same

Bassam Sabbagh:

skill set, I guess, or same way of being. So yeah, it's

Bassam Sabbagh:

transferable, and that's why it's it, it lives, right. It's

Bassam Sabbagh:

not temporary, it can't be shattered by somebody unless you

Bassam Sabbagh:

do it yourself, unless you shatter it yourself.

Nicole York:

Oh, so true. And of course, we talked a little bit

Nicole York:

about sometimes when we have self destructive habits, we can

Nicole York:

do that to ourselves. So we do need to be aware of that, which

Nicole York:

is why that internal monologue is important. So, and we'll get

Nicole York:

to that later as well. But Matt, you were also gonna share self

Nicole York:

confidence. How do you get it? How do you keep it? What do you

Nicole York:

think is important about that process,

Matt Stagliano:

I'm still trying to figure all that out. Because

Matt Stagliano:

from a self confidence standpoint, I've always had

Matt Stagliano:

extraordinarily little, but listening to the song, and I'm

Matt Stagliano:

so glad that he was able to speak first because he said so

Matt Stagliano:

many of the things that I hadn't really formulated in my head,

Matt Stagliano:

but I absolutely agree with, I think for me, my confidence is I

Matt Stagliano:

have difficulty with confidence in the work that I produce. But

Matt Stagliano:

I have unwavering confidence in myself to produce quality work

Matt Stagliano:

over a period of time, I not one of these people that will be oh,

Matt Stagliano:

this first go is going to be perfect. And everyone's going to

Matt Stagliano:

love what I do. It takes me a while to produce work or start

Matt Stagliano:

something new or whatnot. Once I see that I'm capable of doing

Matt Stagliano:

it, then I have the utmost confidence that I'm going to get

Matt Stagliano:

infinitely better at that thing. And there's no one that can stop

Matt Stagliano:

me from getting there. But me. And I think when we start to put

Matt Stagliano:

our own power in to what other people think about what our work

Matt Stagliano:

is it takes erodes our confidence away from us

Matt Stagliano:

producing that thing. So if I'm building a table, or I'm

Matt Stagliano:

painting a painting, or I'm crocheting a blanket, if I'm

Matt Stagliano:

worried about what people think at the end of that thing, then

Matt Stagliano:

I'm already defeating myself and wondering, Am I going to be good

Matt Stagliano:

enough with this for me, I put all of that aside And I say, am

Matt Stagliano:

I can I push myself? Am I capable enough of doing this

Matt Stagliano:

thing. So when it comes to you photography for me, for example,

Matt Stagliano:

it the more I stay off social media, the more I stay away from

Matt Stagliano:

the comparison game and stop looking at other people's work,

Matt Stagliano:

the more confident I feel in my own stuff. Now, when I put

Matt Stagliano:

myself in a position where it's being viewed by others, whether

Matt Stagliano:

that's online or in a competition, or just casual

Matt Stagliano:

viewing by friends, I'm much more confident in it because I

Matt Stagliano:

haven't been doing any comparison, I've just had faith

Matt Stagliano:

in myself. So how I got there was very similar to Cat story, I

Matt Stagliano:

was bullied a lot as a kid, and just had to build up the

Matt Stagliano:

confidence in myself that I could do anything that I didn't

Matt Stagliano:

necessarily need anybody to tell me that I was good. I just

Matt Stagliano:

needed to prove it to myself. So over time, for me, it's a matter

Matt Stagliano:

of get ridding, getting rid of those external affirmations as a

Matt Stagliano:

need for justification of what I'm doing, as long as I have

Matt Stagliano:

faith that I'm capable of this thing, that I can do anything,

Matt Stagliano:

I'm not necessarily going to be a professional basketball

Matt Stagliano:

player, because of you know, genetics. However, I would put

Matt Stagliano:

myself up against anybody playing basketball, because I

Matt Stagliano:

love doing it enough confidence that I can do it, do you not? I

Matt Stagliano:

mean, it's it's it. That's where it all comes from for me.

Nicole York:

Oh, man, oh, man, there's so much good stuff

Nicole York:

there. Okay, Matt, you said something that I think is so

Nicole York:

critical, and almost never gets any airtime is that there's a

Nicole York:

difference between having confidence in our ability to get

Nicole York:

people to like what we do, and confidence in our ability to do

Nicole York:

the thing, right. And one of those is something that's within

Nicole York:

our control. If people remember, for y'all that were here, you

Nicole York:

might remember what I was talking about last week about

Nicole York:

throwing a baseball, you have, once the baseball leaves your

Nicole York:

fingertips, you have no control about where that ball goes.

Nicole York:

Because there's things outside of your control, that are going

Nicole York:

to affect how it flies from wind, to a dog running in

Nicole York:

between you in the ball, etc, etc, right? There are just too

Nicole York:

many things to account for. So thinking that you have control

Nicole York:

over the eventual outcome of the throw is foolish. But knowing

Nicole York:

that you have control over how you stand, how you hold the

Nicole York:

ball, how you breathe, how you release all of those things, you

Nicole York:

can have confidence in those things. Because those are things

Nicole York:

that you actually do. Once the ball leaves your hand. It's up

Nicole York:

to God in the universe, right. And the same thing is true about

Nicole York:

what you said, Matt, if we put our confidence in the ability to

Nicole York:

make things that people love, and then our confidence is built

Nicole York:

on the approbation we get because of what we make. We are

Nicole York:

definitely setting ourselves up for a failure because at some

Nicole York:

point, we're going to make something that people don't

Nicole York:

like, at some point, it's not going to be that good. And all

Nicole York:

of a sudden, that source of confidence, that approbation

Nicole York:

that we get is going to dry up. But if we're careful to place

Nicole York:

our confidence, and our just our ability to do the job, like I

Nicole York:

mentioned, Peggy Serota, last week, she is a photographer, a

Nicole York:

commercial portrait photographer, you've seen her

Nicole York:

work all all over the place magazine covers all over the

Nicole York:

place, she photographed some of the most famous people in the

Nicole York:

world, she is not a confident photographer in terms of

Nicole York:

technique, she will share the fact and has shared the fact

Nicole York:

that when it comes to things like you know, deciding on which

Nicole York:

settings and putting her license certain places, she really

Nicole York:

doesn't do those things that's up to her assistance, what she

Nicole York:

is confident in his her ability to connect with people. And then

Nicole York:

the outcome, the strike, the perfectly thrown ball flows from

Nicole York:

the fact that she knows where her power lies, and that's in

Nicole York:

the ability to connect. So I think, I think Man, your example

Nicole York:

is just so powerful, because it reminds us that the ultimate

Nicole York:

outcome is subjected to powers that are beyond our control.

Nicole York:

Sorry for the car guys. But our ability to do the thing to make

Nicole York:

the decisions to decide how to stand and how to connect, etc,

Nicole York:

etc. That's all on us, right?

Matt Stagliano:

Yes, absolutely. Sorry. Is a rhetorical question

Matt Stagliano:

at the end No, I think you're I think you're absolutely right.

Matt Stagliano:

So for me that's that's really how it all boils down. It's

Matt Stagliano:

looking at like you said, what you can control and what you

Matt Stagliano:

cannot I know that I can control my actions. I know that I can

Matt Stagliano:

control my output, I can control very little outside of that. So

Matt Stagliano:

once I can prove to myself that a thing can be done, then

Matt Stagliano:

there's no stopping me. However, there is also that little voice

Matt Stagliano:

inside like, Oh, am I capable of this? But what I do to combat

Matt Stagliano:

that is say, Well, I've done all these other things that I never

Matt Stagliano:

thought I could do. What would make me believe that this story

Matt Stagliano:

that's going on in my head is any different? Why would I

Matt Stagliano:

believe that I'm incapable of doing this? You know, so I think

Matt Stagliano:

as long as you can look at it, and reframe it and make sure

Matt Stagliano:

that you're not telling yourself a story or a narrative, that

Matt Stagliano:

just isn't true, because it has no basis. In fact, nothing's

Matt Stagliano:

ever been proven that you can't do it. So go ahead and try it,

Matt Stagliano:

you never know. And that's where for me, my confidence has always

Matt Stagliano:

come from expanding my skill set, whether it's language, or

Matt Stagliano:

you know, blue collar skills, or white collar skills, or tech

Matt Stagliano:

skills, whatever it is, all of those things, teach me that I

Matt Stagliano:

can pretty much do anything. So long as I believe that

Matt Stagliano:

narrative, the second that I start telling myself, well, you

Matt Stagliano:

can't do this thing, then, you know, then it's all over, then

Matt Stagliano:

it's more of a battle with myself than anything else. So

Matt Stagliano:

yeah, it's just having that belief, proving yourself wrong,

Matt Stagliano:

that No, actually I can do this. That's where it comes from. For

Matt Stagliano:

me, that's how confidence stems in in me.

Nicole York:

Heck, yeah, muscles. And yeah, there

Nicole York:

definitely seems to be a tension between being careful not to put

Nicole York:

all of our eggs in the basket of approbation and feedback, but

Nicole York:

also needing that proof as a return on investment. And being

Nicole York:

careful to see those things as proof of concept, and not the

Nicole York:

seat of confidence. So there's certainly some subtle tension, I

Nicole York:

think, that goes into that, and relies on us to be able to weigh

Nicole York:

those things. Recognizing the difference between, I can

Nicole York:

control my output, I can't control whether people like it

Nicole York:

to I can judge the fact that this output is good, meaning the

Nicole York:

process is good, as opposed to I must rely solely on the feedback

Nicole York:

of others, in order to feel good about what I've done. So there's

Nicole York:

definitely, definitely even a whole conversation in that in

Nicole York:

and of itself. So. It is your turn. Oh, how do you get it? How

Nicole York:

do you keep it? All the things?

Bekka Bjorke:

I do I do all the things I'm well, I'm interesting

Bekka Bjorke:

to think about because I, I definitely am very self

Bekka Bjorke:

confident and a lot of ways. And then of course, there's places

Bekka Bjorke:

where I absolutely freeze up and terror and I'm not confident in

Bekka Bjorke:

myself at all. But just kind of thinking about what what could

Bekka Bjorke:

sustain that. So like we were talking about goals last week,

Bekka Bjorke:

and I, I mentioned, you know, being really rooted in the small

Bekka Bjorke:

goals, in being in love with your journey, right, like

Bekka Bjorke:

focusing less on the large eventual goals and being really

Bekka Bjorke:

rooted in the here and now. And that definitely ties in a lot to

Bekka Bjorke:

confidence for me. And I don't really have like, huge,

Bekka Bjorke:

ambitious, really long term goals because life is so

Bekka Bjorke:

nebulous, you know, you never know what is going to happen.

Bekka Bjorke:

And really like holding on Super tightly and like tying my

Bekka Bjorke:

identity to any long term eventual future goal. I feel

Bekka Bjorke:

like it's setting myself up for failure. Because what if

Bekka Bjorke:

something happens that doesn't allow me to reach that goal,

Bekka Bjorke:

that doesn't mean I'm failing, and my you know, life is a utter

Bekka Bjorke:

mess, and I need to give up, it just means I need to change and

Bekka Bjorke:

I need to develop. And so being really rooted in who I am at any

Bekka Bjorke:

given moment, I think is so important because you've I guess

Bekka Bjorke:

in the words of the great literary master Dr. Seuss,

Bekka Bjorke:

there's no one alive who is youer than you, and you can't

Bekka Bjorke:

right now be the you that you want to be in five years or be

Bekka Bjorke:

the you you want to be even one year. You are who you are right

Bekka Bjorke:

now today. And you can only do the very best that you could do

Bekka Bjorke:

today. You can't do any better. And so just being very cognizant

Bekka Bjorke:

of what you are capable of, and then you know, leaning into that

Bekka Bjorke:

development of competence and focusing on continuing to learn

Bekka Bjorke:

from where you are right now. I just think is so absolutely

Bekka Bjorke:

important.

Nicole York:

Applause Applause I mean, I agree 100% And that

Nicole York:

you're what you're doing for yourself. of creating a short

Nicole York:

term feedback loop, right, which is, as many of you know, I'm

Nicole York:

going to be participating in NaNoWriMo this month, which is a

Nicole York:

National Novel Writing Month. And the goal is that by the end

Nicole York:

of the month, you will have written 50,000 words of a novel,

Nicole York:

whether that finishes the novel or gets that three quarters of

Nicole York:

the way there or whatever isn't necessarily important, but the

Nicole York:

goal is 50,000 words. And if you start from the beginning, and

Nicole York:

you're thinking to yourself 50,000 words, oh, my God, that's

Nicole York:

a lot of words. How am I going to do that? How can I fit that

Nicole York:

in? Man, it just seems like this big, overpowering impossible

Nicole York:

thing to get your hands on. But if I asked myself, can I write

Nicole York:

1600 words today? Well, yeah, I mean, I can do that. So if I can

Nicole York:

do that today, and then by this evening, I'm sitting down, and I

Nicole York:

have 1600 words on my page. Well, man, I mean, I've just

Nicole York:

proved I can do it, what makes tomorrow any different. And then

Nicole York:

if I do that, if I do that every day, by the end of the month,

Nicole York:

50,000 has happened. I haven't taken any kind of extraordinary

Nicole York:

steps, I've done the small thing that I can do today, and proved

Nicole York:

to myself that I can show up over and over again, all of a

Nicole York:

sudden, I have credibility with myself, I can believe in my

Nicole York:

ability to show up and just write 1600 words, the outcome is

Nicole York:

50,000, at the end of the month, is 100,000 at the end of two

Nicole York:

months. So all of a sudden, those goals that seem so big,

Nicole York:

those things are right within reach, if we can believe in

Nicole York:

ourselves to do the small stuff today. So that's a pretty big

Nicole York:

one. Becca?

Bekka Bjorke:

Yeah. And I mean, it's, I think it's okay to to

Bekka Bjorke:

realize, like you're not going to reach every goal you have,

Bekka Bjorke:

and that is totally okay. It's totally okay, no one does. Like,

Bekka Bjorke:

I don't think that there's a single person who hits every

Bekka Bjorke:

single goal. And that's another thing for me is like looking at,

Bekka Bjorke:

you know, people I admire, you know, people whose careers I

Bekka Bjorke:

would maybe you know, like to emulate in some way, or people's

Bekka Bjorke:

success, every single one of those people has been new at

Bekka Bjorke:

something, and has had to go through struggle to get to where

Bekka Bjorke:

they are, and recognizing that not everything has to be perfect

Bekka Bjorke:

that you are going through this own journey. And that's going to

Bekka Bjorke:

include failure and success. And, you know, again, you are

Bekka Bjorke:

doing the best that you possibly can do for yourself and looking

Bekka Bjorke:

specifically at imaginary you in the future or even at like other

Bekka Bjorke:

people, and trying to emulate their success exactly is not

Bekka Bjorke:

going to work because that's just not how life works. So

Bekka Bjorke:

everyone's gone through the process, everyone's gone through

Bekka Bjorke:

some journey and some hardship. And so whatever you're going

Bekka Bjorke:

through right now, that is part of that, and it's totally okay.

Nicole York:

Yes, yes, yes, yes. Especially because those, you're

Nicole York:

always in the process of becoming. And if you didn't

Nicole York:

reach the goal, you still showed up for yourself. And that leaves

Nicole York:

a mark on you, you know, like that leaves a mark on who you

Nicole York:

are. Which means the next time it's time to show up, you are

Nicole York:

facilitating becoming the kind of person who shows up, maybe

Nicole York:

you didn't reach the 1600. But you still showed up for

Nicole York:

yourself. And that that is a step in the direction of

Nicole York:

becoming the kind of person who, right like, when you ask

Nicole York:

yourself, am I the kind of person who, or tell yourself, I

Nicole York:

am the kind of person who, like, maybe I can't say for sure that

Nicole York:

I'll reach 1600 words a day, but I sure as hell I'm going to show

Nicole York:

up for myself and give it a go. And if I didn't make it, it's

Nicole York:

not the end of the world. I know that I can show up for myself

Nicole York:

again tomorrow. That's an internal thing that's not

Nicole York:

necessarily based on the outcome.

Cat Ford-Coates:

I think it's also important to note too, that

Cat Ford-Coates:

when you're existing through, I don't know your business, right?

Cat Ford-Coates:

If you don't have goals set for yourself, you could very easily

Cat Ford-Coates:

just go through and rinse, repeat cookie cut the whole nine

Cat Ford-Coates:

yards. But when you set goals for yourself that maybe are

Cat Ford-Coates:

outside of your comfort zone, like 1600 words a day or, you

Cat Ford-Coates:

know, reaching new sales targets or you know, insert thing here.

Cat Ford-Coates:

You're more likely to even if you fail at the goal itself, you

Cat Ford-Coates:

will get closer to that goal than you would without having it

Cat Ford-Coates:

in the first place. Like when you get something you will get

Cat Ford-Coates:

closer to that thing than you would when you were not striving

Cat Ford-Coates:

and you were just existing and in motion.

Nicole York:

Yeah, absolutely. So much of what we've talked

Nicole York:

about today relies on some level of tension right on on setting

Nicole York:

goals, but not being crushed when we don't achieve them on

Nicole York:

building that competence and our skill set, but recognizing we

Nicole York:

can't always control the outcome. I mean, there's this

Nicole York:

tension that runs through all of this conversation. And just like

Nicole York:

anything, I mean, we have to recognize the shades of gray and

Nicole York:

the areas where we have to step lightly, and ultimately

Nicole York:

becoming, in a way, unbreakable. And I don't mean that in the

Nicole York:

fact that we will never feel bad or that we will never, you know,

Nicole York:

have a hard time. Never question ourselves or any of that stuff.

Nicole York:

But what I mean is that, it never stops you from picking up

Nicole York:

all the pieces, and chugging on with them again, and having

Nicole York:

confidence, one of the things that I really want to teach my

Nicole York:

boys, and that we try to focus on is giving them opportunities

Nicole York:

to see that they can do hard things. And sometimes that means

Nicole York:

going out and doing, you know, multi day hike in camp and you

Nicole York:

got to live on what you brought with you. And sometimes that's

Nicole York:

maybe we're out climbing, and they're doing a route that's

Nicole York:

really hard, and just encouraging them to finish, even

Nicole York:

though they're scared because they need to see that they can

Nicole York:

overcome those hard things. And of course, they recognize that

Nicole York:

they've got safety gear on and please don't think that I'm out

Nicole York:

there putting my children in danger. But just giving them the

Nicole York:

ability to prove to themselves, to build that credibility that

Nicole York:

when something is hard, they're capable of pushing through, even

Nicole York:

if it only means getting up another foot, or making one more

Nicole York:

handhold, or whatever it is, to go that little step beyond where

Nicole York:

you thought you could. So you can prove to yourself the next

Nicole York:

time it comes along. You can. It's such a big thing, something

Nicole York:

that I think our systems are built to overlook. We want

Nicole York:

people to go just about as far as they're comfortable with and

Nicole York:

that's all. But in your life, you need to know that you're

Nicole York:

capable of pushing past those comfort zones. So I want to make

Nicole York:

sure that we have time to hear from our friends in the audience

Nicole York:

today. Joshua has got his hand up, I did not make my my mods

Nicole York:

mods. I'm doing that right now. Sorry for the delay, guys. I was

Nicole York:

already walking fast this morning. And I overlooked my

Nicole York:

responsibilities. Joshua, I'm I see that your hand is up for

Nicole York:

some reason. It's not showing up down there at the bottom though.

Nicole York:

So I'm going to grab it anyways. But if if you're in the audience

Nicole York:

today, and you have a thought about confidence, what it means

Nicole York:

how we build it, how we can sustain it, or if you feel that

Nicole York:

there's areas you are really comfortable with sharing about

Nicole York:

your confidence in those areas and how you got there. We'd love

Nicole York:

to hear from you this morning. So please feel free to raise

Nicole York:

your hand, we will bring you up. And you can share. Joshua, good

Nicole York:

morning. What are your thoughts on confidence this morning.

Joshua:

Good morning, I jumped a little bit late. But I really

Joshua:

liked what Becca was saying when it came to goal setting. But I

Joshua:

would argue that there are some people that do hit their goals

Joshua:

that they set, they hit all of them. But that's even more

Joshua:

dangerous than coming up short. And that's because they're

Joshua:

setting goals that are so easily attainable, they literally just

Joshua:

wake up and the goal is met. And that creates a false sense of

Joshua:

confidence in your ability to do something because you've

Joshua:

literally done nothing to stretch yourself, you've done

Joshua:

nothing to grow. All you did was meet a goal that ultimately met

Joshua:

nothing. And that's something that I learned when I used to

Joshua:

have a software company that started with a buddy of mine.

Joshua:

And we were going out trying to sell it. And you know, initially

Joshua:

we were just needed, we needed to get some schools in the

Joshua:

system to be beta testers, we needed some customers and to be

Joshua:

beta testers. And I'd go to all these meetings and I leave every

Joshua:

meeting with with everyone saying yes to everything I was

Joshua:

asking for. And eventually, you know, we were opening up and we

Joshua:

were selling and every meeting where I was leaving, I was

Joshua:

getting a sale. Everybody was saying yes. And eventually I was

Joshua:

like, you know, I'm meeting all of my goals, like I'm making all

Joshua:

these sales. But I quickly came to realization. If everyone is

Joshua:

saying yes, all the time, then I'm not stretching myself. I'm

Joshua:

not getting enough. I'm not selling enough. I'm not asking

Joshua:

big enough. And so by me getting yes all the time and building my

Joshua:

confidence. I was actually hurting us because I wasn't

Joshua:

actually getting to where we needed to be. I was just so

Joshua:

happy to be able to get that Yes. Which was my baseline goal,

Joshua:

rather than ultimately you're stepping back and looking at

Joshua:

what we need to do to grow and what was a legitimate goal. What

Joshua:

was a stretch goal? What would require some work and some

Joshua:

effort and what would ultimately what would I fail at trying to

Joshua:

do, but I'd be able to ultimately achieve?

Bekka Bjorke:

That's a great point. Thank you for calling On

Bekka Bjorke:

that I know I can be a little hyperbolic sometimes. But yeah,

Bekka Bjorke:

that's an excellent point.

Nicole York:

Yeah, I'm so glad that you brought that up,

Nicole York:

Joshua, because I think I think you're absolutely right. And

Nicole York:

maybe the initial stages of our confidence often begin with

Nicole York:

those things like those, those first sales in his first

Nicole York:

successes. But I mean, you're absolutely right that, at some

Nicole York:

point, we have to question whether or not we should stay in

Nicole York:

that place in that comfort zone. Because if our goal, our goal is

Nicole York:

to reach the heights, we're never going to get there by

Nicole York:

being comfortable, that absolutely requires the danger

Nicole York:

of failure. And it's, I think, so important for us to

Nicole York:

recognize, I've mentioned before, I know we've talked

Nicole York:

about this, the fact that the word failure is kind of a bad

Nicole York:

word in this room, but not because of the meaning of the

Nicole York:

word itself. But because of what we attach to it. This idea that

Nicole York:

failure means the end, right. And really, it's just a really,

Nicole York:

I've heard somebody say this before, it's an information rich

Nicole York:

data stream, it basically is a way for us to learn a whole lot,

Nicole York:

that we can then turn around and be like, Alright, cool, I failed

Nicole York:

on my way to something. And that means that I already made it as

Nicole York:

far as where that thing stopped. That's the springboard now that

Nicole York:

place that it ended, that's the springboard to the next place,

Nicole York:

and I have all the information I need to get me through there. So

Nicole York:

we have to be really careful that when we're looking at

Nicole York:

these, this, this information that we get back this kind of

Nicole York:

feedback loop that we have action reaction by the

Nicole York:

environment, and then us decoding what that reaction

Nicole York:

means and putting those next steps into place, we do have to

Nicole York:

be careful that when what we get back is not what we want, we

Nicole York:

don't look at that as the end, which means didn't go where I

Nicole York:

wanted to, which means I'm a failure, which means I'm never

Nicole York:

going to be good at this, which means I should just give up

Nicole York:

right? We have to be careful that that thought process does

Nicole York:

not extend from something that makes a lot of sense. I didn't

Nicole York:

push for stretch goals. The company did not get to the

Nicole York:

stretch goal. Therefore I'm a failure. That is not a plus b

Nicole York:

equals c. Right? You're jumping over information there.

Joshua:

Yeah, well, also in the startup world, there's this

Joshua:

belief that money fixes everything. And what ends up

Joshua:

happening a lot of times is young companies end up raising

Joshua:

money really early, before they stretch themselves before they

Joshua:

figure things out. And what they end up doing it they get money.

Joshua:

And and money is, you know, a catalyst, right? It's what you

Joshua:

burn it so you grow fast. And the problem is, if you don't

Joshua:

make those those errors in the beginning, if you don't learn

Joshua:

from those in the beginning, before you before you hit that

Joshua:

callus point at that point of like significant growth, then

Joshua:

you pour the money on it, which is pouring fuel on the fire, but

Joshua:

your fire is burning down your building rather than lighting a

Joshua:

rocket. And that's just as dangerous.

Nicole York:

That was the knowledge bomb there. Yes. So

Nicole York:

much. You're absolutely right. Not only is it a catalyst, and

Nicole York:

it can become a bandaid, right. And so you've got that bandaid

Nicole York:

on and the wound is festering underneath and you don't even

Nicole York:

know it. So, man, that's such a good, a good point. And

Nicole York:

something that's really important for us to keep in

Nicole York:

mind. As we as we do try to stretch ourselves and making

Nicole York:

sure, as we've mentioned before, that we are using the right

Nicole York:

metrics to measure things. And that comes back to confidence as

Nicole York:

well, if that metric that we're using is something that can be

Nicole York:

taken or broken, then obviously at some point it will be. And so

Nicole York:

we have to understand that and keep that in mind. Linus, I saw

Nicole York:

that your hand was up it was trying to grab you. I'm not sure

Nicole York:

if it's working for some reason, the hands up has not been

Nicole York:

showing for me as notifications on the bottom. So I might need

Nicole York:

to update my my club has but I see you've been able to join us.

Nicole York:

We'd love to hear your thoughts on confidence.

Linus:

Hi, Nicole. It's a morning walk in photos. All

Linus:

right. So as an artist room, I assume that we are talking in

Linus:

the context of a photograph a little bit or just as a person.

Nicole York:

Yeah, what we really believe that the people

Nicole York:

that we are also determined how well we do as photographers, so

Nicole York:

wherever you feel the most comfortable talking about this,

Nicole York:

whether that's business or personal or work itself. Would

Nicole York:

love to hear it.

Unknown:

I would just like to make sure that I'm in context,

Unknown:

you know how some people would just invade rooms and talk out

Nicole York:

Yes. That and yes, I was listening to you

Unknown:

and I was listening to you and then what USA What do

Unknown:

you just in short, basically, if you we should not let our

Unknown:

failures basically deter We should let you know, our

Unknown:

feelings is not the end of this. I have something to add to that

Unknown:

actually, I think that sometimes our feelings become our

Unknown:

greatness. Because there is the thing about photography is that,

Unknown:

you know, like, when you are learning, it is actually a

Unknown:

process of comparing a process of basically, you take your

Unknown:

pictures, and then you compare it to the works of other

Unknown:

photographers, especially when you're new, right? You You are

Unknown:

always searching for what would sell? And what would define you,

Unknown:

and how can you get better. So when when you go into this

Unknown:

process of comparing to others, you tend to have this, you

Unknown:

sometimes put yourself into a box whereby, you know, you're

Unknown:

always judging yourself, like, you know, like, sometimes you

Unknown:

may have taken a really nice picture, that you have a nice

Unknown:

picture in the sense that you have infused all the meaning

Unknown:

that, you know, you've thought about the picture, you've got

Unknown:

exposure, right? You you maybe got the right setting, or the

Unknown:

right talent or whatsoever, and you're really proud of the

Unknown:

picture. And in today's world, all it takes sometimes it's a

Unknown:

Google search. And then you find a picture that has, you know,

Unknown:

similar themes, and it's better than you and then sometimes you

Unknown:

will go like, Oh shit, you know, then suddenly, that picture that

Unknown:

you take, that was just a moment ago, so great to you. It doesn't

Unknown:

become that good, after all. So just to give you a bit of my

Unknown:

history, I'm actually a DOP, Director photography. I started

Unknown:

in 35 mm film. And now I work li I work mainly in digital, but I

Unknown:

still load my Hasselblad with film. And I still love to take

Unknown:

film, even though even though it's harder process in the sense

Unknown:

that I need to how you say, think the light meter reading

Unknown:

figure it out, before I press the tick button. I actually

Unknown:

really like the imperfection of film. I really like the grain

Unknown:

sometimes I even expose wrongly because sometimes you know, the

Unknown:

bad exposure and the slight grain. It harkens back to when

Unknown:

the time before I became a photographer, the time when I

Unknown:

was a small boy. And the time when my non father fotografo

Unknown:

would try to take picture of me on film. And he may have hit

Unknown:

that exposure wrong. So the picture comes out a little bit

Unknown:

grainy, a little bit imperfect. And that has a very sentimental

Unknown:

kind of feeling for me. So the thing is that what the point I'm

Unknown:

trying to make is why why do we let perfection defines us, you

Unknown:

know, when there is so much heart and just doing what you

Unknown:

do. And sometimes when you are just aiming for perfection. And

Unknown:

you know, when you just keep on looking and letting society be

Unknown:

the judge of what is right. You no longer do what you inherently

Unknown:

want to do and what you internally set out to do. So I

Unknown:

was very, very lucky because in my career, where everybody is

Unknown:

always trying to chase you know, what is the Chinese glossiest

Unknown:

picture. When I was actually serving my internship when I was

Unknown:

actually serving, you know, like, making my steps up. I met

Unknown:

with director in Malaysia, and she became my mentor. And she

Unknown:

was one of the more renowned director in my country and from

Unknown:

Malaysia. And the way that she does thing is now actually

Unknown:

emulated by a lot of people in the world. And the way that she

Unknown:

does things is that she wants to do it humbly. And she wants to

Unknown:

basically make pictures that are not perfect. But pictures that

Unknown:

resemble the, the society that she sees in, in the everyday,

Unknown:

you know, Watson all and for that she was very much loved.

Unknown:

And the work shines. And today I find myself often asking my

Unknown:

client, you know, what do you want to say? What do you want to

Unknown:

say in the picture? And that's it really need to be glossy?

Unknown:

Does everything in front of your eye look glossy? Or do you see

Unknown:

the imperfection and maybe we should just infuse a little bit.

Unknown:

So I hope that I've contributed to this room. And if you do like

Unknown:

my share, I would appreciate it. I have a small YouTube. It's on

Unknown:

my it's on my profile greatly to stories I would appreciate if

Unknown:

you just come by. He doesn't you don't have to subscribe if you

Unknown:

don't like it. Thank you very much. Thank you very much,

Unknown:

Nicole.

Nicole York:

Thank you for joining us today Linus and yeah,

Nicole York:

folks, go go ahead and check his YouTube out. I think you you

Nicole York:

bring up some really important and valid points. And there's

Nicole York:

certainly a question of whether or not we should be chasing

Nicole York:

perfection. You know, I've argued before that I don't think

Nicole York:

perfection is a real thing. I think it is an illusion. That is

Nicole York:

100%, you know, based off of the idea that it's possible to

Nicole York:

actually be without error or failure, which I don't believe

Nicole York:

is true. But I really love that you bring up the fact that there

Nicole York:

is real beauty in those imperfections, and the fact that

Nicole York:

oftentimes, more than our successes, our identity comes

Nicole York:

from our failures, which is why it's something that we should

Nicole York:

not be afraid of. Because the times that we do succeed in the

Nicole York:

future, are ultimately based on what failures we had, what we

Nicole York:

learned from those things, and how overcoming, defined us how

Nicole York:

it helps to define who we are, and how that person shows up in

Nicole York:

life. And I think that's one of the reasons that we're careful

Nicole York:

in here about using the word failure. Because oftentimes,

Nicole York:

when people have different definitions, you kind of smuggle

Nicole York:

your own definition into the thing, based on your experience

Nicole York:

in your life. That's the way communication works. But it's so

Nicole York:

important to keep in mind that we look at failure as, as a

Nicole York:

society, often, particularly Western society is, is such a

Nicole York:

negative thing. And really, it can become an absolute thing of

Nicole York:

beauty because of what it brings about in our life. And I've seen

Nicole York:

this happen. So many times, I felt it myself, gone through the

Nicole York:

struggle of recognizing that I've built my identity, and

Nicole York:

based my self confidence in a place that was breakable. And

Nicole York:

had to watch myself and, and have the fight of becoming that

Nicole York:

new person as a result of those breaks. And all of a sudden,

Nicole York:

because I know what that looks like and what that feels like,

Nicole York:

I'm able to see and find the beauty in it. So as we come to

Nicole York:

the end, or as we are at the end of our hour. Today, I want to

Nicole York:

just recap a little bit of what we talked about over the course

Nicole York:

of our hour this morning. And understanding first, that when

Nicole York:

we look at something like self confidence, as an artist as a

Nicole York:

person, the first thing that we need to understand is that the

Nicole York:

seat of our confidence is either something that is breakable, or

Nicole York:

it's something that is flexible. And if you choose to allow

Nicole York:

yourself to become confident in outcomes, rather than confident

Nicole York:

in an ability or a proclivity for something, there really is

Nicole York:

the chance that those things are going to fall apart. Because we

Nicole York:

cannot control the end game, we can only control how we play.

Nicole York:

Also understanding that when we talk about self confidence, what

Nicole York:

we're really talking about is our credibility with ourself,

Nicole York:

can I believe myself, when I say I'm going to do this thing? If I

Nicole York:

can, that's where the confidence comes from. And oftentimes that

Nicole York:

requires building a skill set, going through the difficulty and

Nicole York:

then having some kind of proof on the other side, that will

Nicole York:

represent what we've done, it becomes a feedback loop. And in

Nicole York:

order to do any of this stuff, the first thing we have to do is

Nicole York:

be paying attention to who we believe ourselves to be and what

Nicole York:

we say about ourselves to ourselves. So I mentioned

Nicole York:

earlier, I was going to touch on this, as Kat was talking about,

Nicole York:

you know, her experience as a younger person being bullied and

Nicole York:

then how she kind of faked her way into that initial appearance

Nicole York:

of confidence that began to grow over time. And

Nicole York:

everything starts in our head. Everything starts with what we

Nicole York:

say to ourselves and about ourselves. Because what you

Nicole York:

believe to be true will be true for you and that it will affect

Nicole York:

how you behave. And the results that you get back. And if I tell

Nicole York:

myself, I'm no good at this. I'm never going to be able to do it.

Nicole York:

I'll never sell this much. I'll never take this shot. I'll never

Nicole York:

work with this person. I'll never see myself in this life

Nicole York:

that I would have dreamed about for myself. If I tell myself

Nicole York:

those things. Often enough, my behavior will reflect those

Nicole York:

things and the outcome will reflect the behavior So we have

Nicole York:

to watch the stories that we tell ourselves. I know that

Nicole York:

anybody who's been here with us for any amount of time will

Nicole York:

recognize this as the main through line for me, because it

Nicole York:

is the most important thing we can do. The stories that we tell

Nicole York:

ourselves, are the key to everything we do and believe

Nicole York:

about who we are. If you tell yourself that the good results

Nicole York:

are chance, and fate, that's what you're going to believe you

Nicole York:

will behave like you have no control over the outcome. If you

Nicole York:

tell yourself that the results are based on, not my ability to

Nicole York:

control fate, but my ability to work hard, then working hard

Nicole York:

becomes the pathway. So the things that we tell ourselves

Nicole York:

ultimately become reality for us. And if you probably just

Nicole York:

heard my watch telling me that I did a good job walking this

Nicole York:

morning. Yeah. So if we want to look at self confidence as

Nicole York:

something we can build and achieve for ourselves, whether

Nicole York:

that is in who we are in the work that we produce in our

Nicole York:

ability to make an income from the work that we produce all of

Nicole York:

these different areas. Everything begins with what we

Nicole York:

tell ourselves with our internal narrative with that monologue,

Nicole York:

the stories that we tell ourselves about who we are. And

Nicole York:

then that extends out into where that confidence is placed, are

Nicole York:

we placing it in our ability to get results? are we placing it

Nicole York:

on our ability to do a thing, if I place myself confidence in my

Nicole York:

ability to work hard to be curious, and to have to know

Nicole York:

that my motivation will always be centered and love,

Nicole York:

recognizing that to do a thing for somebody else means I

Nicole York:

believe that I'm doing something that is serving their best

Nicole York:

interest. That's not something that will be easily taken from

Nicole York:

me by circumstance, almost no matter where I'm at, that is

Nicole York:

something I will be able to fall back in and have confidence in.

Nicole York:

Because it cannot be broken by somebody reacting to me badly

Nicole York:

not liking my work, not buying the photograph, none of those

Nicole York:

things can affect me understanding that my motivation

Nicole York:

comes out of a place of love. So the stories we tell ourselves,

Nicole York:

knowing where that self confidence is at recognizing

Nicole York:

that we as people are malleable, and if we have narratives and

Nicole York:

behaviors that don't serve us, those things can be changed. You

Nicole York:

don't have to be the person that you are today, tomorrow, if you

Nicole York:

don't want to be. But like Becca said, those things are small

Nicole York:

goals, we're always taking small steps towards something, we get

Nicole York:

to choose what that thing is. And

Nicole York:

giving ourselves those little wins every single day that

Nicole York:

reinforce our confidence that reinforce our abilities to do

Nicole York:

the things that we say we want to do. And then doing hard

Nicole York:

things and recognizing that failure will sometimes be a

Nicole York:

result. And that is not the end, it is part of the journey. And

Nicole York:

it becomes beautiful that way. Kat mentioned some of the

Nicole York:

difficulties that she had when beginning her career, and that

Nicole York:

she basically was taking, she was taking cell phone mortality,

Nicole York:

she was taking a leap into the void, she was jumping to her

Nicole York:

death and counting on wings to grow on the way down. And there

Nicole York:

is a kind of internal strength that happens when you take those

Nicole York:

risks. When you push yourself so far outside of your comfort

Nicole York:

zone, the only choice you have is to succeed. There's a

Nicole York:

strength in that. And failure is inevitable, when you jump often

Nicole York:

enough, but remember that that failure becomes a springboard to

Nicole York:

the next thing. So today was a really amazing conversation, so

Nicole York:

much great insight and feedback into human nature and into the

Nicole York:

way we think and two different things that we can do if we are

Nicole York:

sitting in a place where we don't have a whole lot of

Nicole York:

confidence in ourselves, and that encouragement to go out to

Nicole York:

do hard things, to build credibility with ourselves to

Nicole York:

recognize that if we just start by showing up for ourselves,

Nicole York:

that is the first step. And also recognizing that the power and

Nicole York:

the belief should come from us being able to do the thing and

Nicole York:

not control the outcome. I can control how I stand. I can

Nicole York:

control how I hold the baseball, I can control how I release the

Nicole York:

baseball and how I breathe. I can't control whether or not the

Nicole York:

baseball hits the glove. That part of it isn't up to me. So

Nicole York:

focus on the things that we can control. Recognize that there is

Nicole York:

no such thing ultimately as a wrong outcome if we can learn

Nicole York:

from it and integrate it. And also like Becca said, where

Nicole York:

you're at today is okay, where you're at today is beautiful and

Nicole York:

good. But it doesn't also have to be where you're going to be

Nicole York:

tomorrow, you get to make that decision for yourself. So I'm so

Nicole York:

glad you were here with us today. Thank you to everybody

Nicole York:

who came up and shared your experiences, your your insights,

Nicole York:

it's so, so powerful. And I really hope that you will join

Nicole York:

us again tomorrow morning, bright and early at 7am.

Nicole York:

Mountain Standard Time. That's 6am for the west coast in the

Nicole York:

US. 9am for the East Coast, usually, late afternoon for our

Nicole York:

friends overseas. Come hang out with us. We're always in here

Nicole York:

looking at how we can be the bridge between technique and

Nicole York:

art. And go make something amazing. We'll see you bright

Nicole York:

and early tomorrow morning. Have a fantastic day, everybody.

Matt Stagliano:

Thanks again for listening to this live clubhouse

Matt Stagliano:

discussion moderated by all of us at the artist Forge. We hope

Matt Stagliano:

you found the information useful and then it helps you gain a

Matt Stagliano:

little bit of insight as to how you work on your craft. For more

Matt Stagliano:

episodes, please join us each weekday on clubhouse or visit

Matt Stagliano:

the artists forge.com and go make something incredible

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About the Podcast

Morning Walk with The Artist's Forge
How to Critique Art
Learn how mindset, creativity, and visual literacy will help you think like an artist so you can create work you love and build a career that matters; bridging the gap between technique and art.

About your host

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Nicole York