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Published on:

8th Mar 2022

Staying Motivated to Create

Learn more about how to think like an artist on The Artist's Forge, and join our growing community of artists on Facebook.

Want to know more about the hosts?

Nicole York

Matt Stagliano

Cat Ford-Coates

Bassam Sabbagh

Bekka Bjorke

Transcript
Matt Stagliano:

Hi, this is Matt Stagliano and thanks for being

Matt Stagliano:

part of the artists Forge. We're a community of creatives who

Matt Stagliano:

help each other think like an artist. By discussing creativity

Matt Stagliano:

as a process instead of a skill or a talent. We believe everyone

Matt Stagliano:

has what it takes to create something amazing. We just need

Matt Stagliano:

some encouragement and inspiration along the way. What

Matt Stagliano:

you're about to hear is a live recording of one of our daily

Matt Stagliano:

discussions on the clubhouse app. If you like what you hear,

Matt Stagliano:

I encourage you to join our private Facebook group, or visit

Matt Stagliano:

us on the web at the artist forged calm. Now on to the show.

Nicole York:

Good morning, everybody. Welcome to morning

Nicole York:

walk with the artists Forge. My name is Nicole York. I'm your

Nicole York:

host. And today we're talking about motivation. So we put up a

Nicole York:

poll in the Facebook group, oh, I got to make people moderators,

Nicole York:

we put up a poll in the Facebook group, just to see what are some

Nicole York:

of the topics of conversation that people want to be happening

Nicole York:

here in the artist Forge? And if you have not, can you go not

Nicole York:

only vote on that, but add your own suggestions, I know that

Nicole York:

everybody's got some topics, some things that they would love

Nicole York:

to talk about, or hear spoken about, just because we all

Nicole York:

struggle with stuff. But also, there's so many interesting

Nicole York:

things out there. We could be conversating about. So if you

Nicole York:

want to head over to the Facebook group, maybe I can talk

Nicole York:

besar into putting the link up there. I'm wearing gloves. And

Nicole York:

my fingers are working so well. Thank you. But if you could go

Nicole York:

in and add a topic, go vote on what you'd like to, you know,

Nicole York:

have a chat about in the mornings. That would be super

Nicole York:

helpful. But so far, it seems like the leader of the potential

Nicole York:

topic conversation is staying motivated. So I thought it would

Nicole York:

be a really good morning to chat about that, particularly, as

Nicole York:

things are starting to get wonky. For some of us again,

Nicole York:

there's shutdowns going on in Canada, a lot of other places.

Nicole York:

And it's just a really difficult time to try to make a living as

Nicole York:

an artist. But also, I've you know, so I was speaking to

Nicole York:

somebody yesterday. And they were talking about the

Nicole York:

frustration of being capable enough in their art form, that

Nicole York:

they were able to do a lot of things but not as capable as

Nicole York:

they wanted to be their musician, not as capable as they

Nicole York:

want it to be to be able to play the things that they want it.

Nicole York:

And so we had this conversation about the struggle of

Nicole York:

maintaining that motivation as well, particularly when they

Nicole York:

have a regular day job. And they're only playing when

Nicole York:

they're off of work. And so there's the motivation of well,

Nicole York:

now I'm done with the regular stuff, I want to work on my

Nicole York:

thing, but I'm tired. And I just, I don't always feel like

Nicole York:

it. And then when I play, and I haven't been practicing, of

Nicole York:

course, the lack of practice shows up. And so there's the

Nicole York:

frustration in that, right. And it can really easily make us not

Nicole York:

feel motivated to keep moving forward with our passions. So we

Nicole York:

absolutely have that difficulty staying motivated in the long

Nicole York:

term for the art that we love, when it's not a job. And we can

Nicole York:

have those difficulties staying motivated in the art that we

Nicole York:

love when we're trying to make a living off of it. And of course,

Nicole York:

there's an entirely different set of repercussions that are

Nicole York:

tied to that. So that is going to be today's conversation, how

Nicole York:

do we stay motivated? How do we keep up that forward momentum or

Nicole York:

even the drive to want to keep doing the thing. I've had a lot

Nicole York:

of photographer friends lately, let me know that they just feel

Nicole York:

done. They can't summon up any passion or any motivation. They

Nicole York:

can't make themselves love what they're doing anymore. It has

Nicole York:

moved to the point where it really does feel like just a job

Nicole York:

that they're doing to put money on the table. And not anything

Nicole York:

they care to be doing anymore. So it can be a really rough

Nicole York:

spot. And if we tackle that today, hopefully that'll help

Nicole York:

lots and lots, folks. So beginning with friends on the

Nicole York:

panel, y'all how do we do this? I know, cat has been in business

Nicole York:

for 10 plus years. I know all of us have been through multiple

Nicole York:

iterations, maybe not of the business we have now. But of

Nicole York:

what we've been doing and seeing that, you know, be birthed in

Nicole York:

different ways. And so in one way or another, we've been doing

Nicole York:

this work for a long time. How do we keep going, especially

Nicole York:

when circumstances get so frustrating, and can just

Nicole York:

demoralize you. How do we keep how do we keep it up?

Cat Ford-Coates:

It'll actually be 10 years in March. I should

Cat Ford-Coates:

throw a party

Nicole York:

You should.

Cat Ford-Coates:

Um, I know for me like I either completely and

Cat Ford-Coates:

totally disconnect and turn everything off and say fuck off

Cat Ford-Coates:

to the world. Or, if that's not an option, the first place is

Cat Ford-Coates:

literally just move my body it can be go for a walk, it can be

Cat Ford-Coates:

jump up and down. It can be, I don't know, Kickboxing with my

Cat Ford-Coates:

dogs in the living room. But like that kinetic piece is, has

Cat Ford-Coates:

been leveraged on more than one occasion to kind of get into

Cat Ford-Coates:

flow to get shit done.

Nicole York:

You know what cat? I think so many people would

Nicole York:

never even have thought to give that answer. And I love that you

Nicole York:

did, because we underestimate. I think we forget the fact that we

Nicole York:

live in bodies that were meant to be active, because so much of

Nicole York:

our work can kind of be contained to a small area, like

Nicole York:

our studio or workstation or whatever it is that we're

Nicole York:

working in, it seems like all of life is kind of tied up in that

Nicole York:

spot. And we forget that we do have bodies that were meant to

Nicole York:

move and that our literal mental health is tied to the ability to

Nicole York:

move our bodies. That's why when we start to lose that ability, a

Nicole York:

lot of cognitive decline happens, a lot of depression can

Nicole York:

happen. And of course, this doesn't mean that if we have

Nicole York:

limited motion, we're doomed to not be happy. But within the

Nicole York:

scope of what we're capable of, we really need to be promoting

Nicole York:

some kind of physical movement. And this is not for the purpose

Nicole York:

of like, getting a beach body, right? Like this is for the

Nicole York:

purpose of literally making your synapses fire and making

Nicole York:

connections happen and getting blood flowing. And just allowing

Nicole York:

your body to be the moving machinery that it's supposed to

Nicole York:

be in It's wild. How much it really does affect the

Nicole York:

motivation you have in all other parts of your life.

Cat Ford-Coates:

Oh, it definitely does. You know, I was

Cat Ford-Coates:

talking with a friend of mine yesterday. And you know, winter

Cat Ford-Coates:

seasonal depression is a thing. And, you know, when you have

Cat Ford-Coates:

those longer winters, like when I lived in Boston, you know, I

Cat Ford-Coates:

moved to Boston from Florida. And so I went from eight months

Cat Ford-Coates:

of summer to eight months of winter. And after four years was

Cat Ford-Coates:

like, I literally cannot do this anymore. Because you are so

Cat Ford-Coates:

limited in what you're able to do is that mean? You can't like

Cat Ford-Coates:

do a Beachbody workout at home. Of course not. But like that

Cat Ford-Coates:

ability to move about and transform and grow and do the

Cat Ford-Coates:

things is much more limited when you're in a tighter space. And

Cat Ford-Coates:

it does affect your your mood and your mental stability. And

Cat Ford-Coates:

being able to actually get out in the world and do things is a

Cat Ford-Coates:

big deal. So when I left Boston, I was just like, Fuck this, get

Cat Ford-Coates:

me out of here. And I came to North Carolina and was like, Oh,

Cat Ford-Coates:

now I have four equal seasons. I can go do the things now.

Nicole York:

Yeah, it's crazy how much it makes a difference.

Nicole York:

And I've noticed something really similar. Living in

Nicole York:

Colorado, and then in the southwest. My ability to get out

Nicole York:

and do things at all times of the year. I mean, it's cold

Nicole York:

right now. But as soon as the sun comes up, it can be in the

Nicole York:

teens. And as long as I have a jacket on, I'm cool. I'm like,

Nicole York:

Yeah, I could do this. So I'm not hampered by the weather. And

Nicole York:

it really does make a difference in the stability of my mood,

Nicole York:

even when other things are going wrong. And I'm struggling. That

Nicole York:

ability to just to get outside and move, which is why this is

Nicole York:

the morning walk right? sets my day off in the right way. And on

Nicole York:

the days when I don't walk, I really do feel the difference.

Nicole York:

And it's also interesting that you mentioned winter, because I

Nicole York:

think this time of year, there really is something that happens

Nicole York:

internally to the human soul, which is why we tend to have

Nicole York:

things like you will and Saturnalia and Christmas and we

Nicole York:

make holidays and we sing sad songs. Like we have all of these

Nicole York:

traditions across the world where it gets really cold and,

Nicole York:

and yucky in the wintertime to try to deal with what happens to

Nicole York:

us internally during this time of year. It's kind of a dark

Nicole York:

night of the soul time of year and I think there really can be

Nicole York:

incredible benefits to it. Particularly if it if we go into

Nicole York:

it the right way. But also it's a really difficult thing to

Nicole York:

manage and coming from the Pacific Northwest. You know

Nicole York:

seasonal depression. It's sad, right? Seasonal Affective

Nicole York:

Disorder. is a is a real thing. And if we don't recognize that,

Nicole York:

and we don't take some of those steps, I mean, we don't even

Nicole York:

need to mention, even though I mentioning it, how many studies

Nicole York:

have been done on the way that exercise affects your mood, your

Nicole York:

stress levels, all of the different things, your

Nicole York:

happiness, et cetera, et cetera. That a, it's just a really

Nicole York:

fantastic reminder to have, I think, no matter where you're

Nicole York:

at. For show, so what else y'all what are some other things we

Nicole York:

can do to keep us motivated? What it feels like, being happy

Nicole York:

making art, or, you know, moving forward in our chosen career

Nicole York:

field is is a slog, and we don't feel happy.

Matt Stagliano:

You know, I'm gonna get all hippy woo on this,

Matt Stagliano:

right? So, for me, who I've been going through this exact thing

Matt Stagliano:

for probably the past month and a half or two months, and the

Matt Stagliano:

way that I'm working through it, as we speak, is understanding

Matt Stagliano:

what my original Why was, why did I start doing this in the

Matt Stagliano:

first place? What was the thing that captured my attention? And

Matt Stagliano:

my interest in my Wonder and my curiosity? What was it that

Matt Stagliano:

allowed me to have the passion for what I do in the first

Matt Stagliano:

place, and understanding that all of these passions and all of

Matt Stagliano:

these interests change over time, as we uplevel our skill,

Matt Stagliano:

or as our interests change, or as life changes, whatever it

Matt Stagliano:

might be? All of those things start to change over time, and

Matt Stagliano:

we lose focus on what it was originally, that drew us to it.

Matt Stagliano:

So for me, I have to understand, alright, well, what is my goal?

Matt Stagliano:

Is my goal, to just make money and go home? Is my goal to make

Matt Stagliano:

art? is my goal to make other people happy? What is it that

Matt Stagliano:

that I have as a goal? And why do I feel I'm not reaching that?

Matt Stagliano:

What are the changes that I need to make, to get back to that

Matt Stagliano:

point of curiosity and wonder and passion? And so part of it

Matt Stagliano:

is looking at, you know, what you're doing now? And what are

Matt Stagliano:

the outcomes that you're tying those actions to? What do you

Matt Stagliano:

want those outcomes to look like? And what are the small

Matt Stagliano:

steps that you need to take every single day to keep hitting

Matt Stagliano:

that motivated point, right? Because we all know, it's kind

Matt Stagliano:

of this law of compound interest, the these small atomic

Matt Stagliano:

habits, right? That you put in place, wind up making big

Matt Stagliano:

changes. So if you find yourself in this place of lacked

Matt Stagliano:

motivation, or lessened motivation, and you want to get

Matt Stagliano:

back to that place of passion, what are the small steps that

Matt Stagliano:

you have to take, it might be just something as easy as

Matt Stagliano:

shutting your phone off. And you know, spending time being

Matt Stagliano:

present mindfulness, whatever it might be, but start asking

Matt Stagliano:

yourself the questions of, you know, what was I passionate

Matt Stagliano:

about? What has happened between then and now, which has taken me

Matt Stagliano:

off that path? And how can I start making small steps to get

Matt Stagliano:

back there, because if you do it in one big sweeping change, then

Matt Stagliano:

you're less likely to succeed than if you build those habits

Matt Stagliano:

on a strong foundation. So for me going through this, again, to

Matt Stagliano:

wrap up is just asking myself the questions of what is it that

Matt Stagliano:

really brings me into photography? And how can I keep

Matt Stagliano:

tapping into that feeling of wonder and curiosity every

Matt Stagliano:

single day?

Nicole York:

I love that mat. And I'm really glad that you

Nicole York:

mentioned it. And I know we talked before, several times in

Nicole York:

this room, about finding our why, and asking ourselves why

Nicole York:

we're doing this, like what is the deep heart motivation behind

Nicole York:

this thing. And I certainly have found myself in the same

Nicole York:

position where my y becomes my anchor in the storm, right?

Nicole York:

Like, things could be wrong, or things could be hard. And it

Nicole York:

look back at that. And I remind myself, that's why this is why

Nicole York:

I'm here. This is why I'm willing to climb this mountain,

Nicole York:

all right out the storm, whatever metaphor works for

Nicole York:

where you're at in your life right now. But being able to

Nicole York:

have that anchor hold me fast, really makes a big difference.

Nicole York:

Because I think one of the things that we struggle with is

Nicole York:

the fact that we feel like we are supposed to be motivated all

Nicole York:

the time. Right? Like we have this idea in our head, that if

Nicole York:

we're not super excited and passionate about what we're

Nicole York:

doing every single day, that something must be wrong, and it

Nicole York:

could be that's why we have to ask ourselves these questions.

Nicole York:

But I also think we need to normalize the fact that we're

Nicole York:

going to go through these seasons or phases. Within the

Nicole York:

thing that we're doing. We're gonna have those seasons of

Nicole York:

amazing growth and excitement where everything's kicking and

Nicole York:

engines are firing on all cylinders and we're Just just

Nicole York:

jazz to be here. And then we're going to have those seasons

Nicole York:

where it's still pretty good. I mean, we're doing our thing, but

Nicole York:

it's not like mind blowing or anything. And then we're gonna

Nicole York:

have those seasons where it's frustrating. And we feel like

Nicole York:

we're climbing our way for every scrap that we get. And then

Nicole York:

we're gonna have other times when we feel apathetic, and

Nicole York:

recognizing that I think and taking some of the stigma out of

Nicole York:

that feeling, and knowing that it's okay to be there. But we

Nicole York:

don't have to stay there forever, right? But then making

Nicole York:

sure that number one, we recognize that it's okay to be

Nicole York:

there. And then number two, we take those steps, like you said,

Nicole York:

we ask ourselves, okay, well, what was my why is it still

Nicole York:

worthwhile. And I know, we've also talked about the fact that

Nicole York:

our businesses are going to grow and change, our y's are going to

Nicole York:

grow and change as we grow and change. And so being able to

Nicole York:

look at that, for some of us, we're going to be able to say,

Nicole York:

Okay, it's normal, to not feel super excited about what I'm

Nicole York:

doing every single day. But is this hurting my life? Is this

Nicole York:

progressing in a way where I need to start looking into

Nicole York:

things I connect to my wife? And I realized that why does it fit

Nicole York:

my life anymore? It doesn't fit what I want to do. Things have

Nicole York:

changed. And maybe it is coming back to that, that reason and

Nicole York:

changing it so that we can move forward. That will matter. And

Nicole York:

maybe it's No, My why is still there. So I need to do the

Nicole York:

things that you mentioned, start looking at my habits and my

Nicole York:

processes and see what I can change there that will actually

Nicole York:

give me that reinvigoration and energize me to do the things. So

Nicole York:

I think there's so much important tied up in what you

Nicole York:

just said.

Matt Stagliano:

Thanks. Yeah, I think it's I think it's just

Matt Stagliano:

important. You know, I'm a big introspection guy. We all know

Matt Stagliano:

this. I think that's where I draw the motivation is kind of

Matt Stagliano:

getting back to source. Just getting back to the original

Matt Stagliano:

questions. And feeling those feelings again. Oh, God, I

Matt Stagliano:

remember what it was like when I was at this place, or I shot

Matt Stagliano:

this picture or whatnot. And it gives you that feeling. And it's

Matt Stagliano:

that feeling that can help you build, lease, it helps me change

Matt Stagliano:

my mindset immediately. So it's all about feelings and

Matt Stagliano:

motivation for me.

Nicole York:

Yep, I'm with you there. And then I noticed Erika

Nicole York:

has her hand up, and I was trying to bring her up. I can't

Nicole York:

tell it. That's an accident. Erica, you've already been

Nicole York:

invited.

Bassam Sabbagh:

But I tried also. Yes, I can't bring

Nicole York:

up. Okay, so I'm not sure what's going on there.

Nicole York:

Something is wonky. But we do want to hear from you, if you

Nicole York:

can share. So what else y'all we've we've kind of talked about

Nicole York:

the fact that just a simple everyday act of moving our

Nicole York:

bodies can be enough to get things fired up for us.

Nicole York:

Sometimes we need to reconnect with our why and ask ourselves,

Nicole York:

is this still valid? And if it is, what changes can I make?

Nicole York:

That will put me back into alignment with that, why we've

Nicole York:

also talked about the fact that we need to normalize, that we're

Nicole York:

not always going to be super excited and passionate, it's

Nicole York:

normal to go through these, these different seasons in our

Nicole York:

careers are in our forward motion, and that's okay, as

Nicole York:

well. And that we shouldn't necessarily feel like there's

Nicole York:

something wrong with us. If we're in one of those seasons,

Nicole York:

we just have to be present enough to recognize it. And then

Nicole York:

ask ourselves those questions, right? Like, sometimes our art

Nicole York:

career, or our art passion is going to go through the winter.

Nicole York:

And it's gonna seem like it's dead, and it's dying. But when

Nicole York:

we come back in the spring, we see this reinvigoration and big

Nicole York:

growth and change. And I know that's been true for me. But I

Nicole York:

do have to ask myself, Is this a normal part of a season for me?

Nicole York:

Or is something else going on? And that's where reconnecting to

Nicole York:

your why and asking those questions, I think becomes so so

Nicole York:

valuable. So what else can we do to keep ourselves motivated or

Nicole York:

to get our motivation back?

Bekka Bjorke:

Hi, my name is Becca Grayson Holic. And that is

Bekka Bjorke:

not a sustainable way to run an art business at all. It's like

Bekka Bjorke:

this superpower I have, that's a double edged sword at the same

Bekka Bjorke:

time. So what I end up doing is I definitely hit that roadblock.

Bekka Bjorke:

When working on a certain project at a time. It's you

Bekka Bjorke:

know, when you when you start on something and it's exciting and

Bekka Bjorke:

you're feeling that inspiration and it's invigorating, and

Bekka Bjorke:

you're just all in and then after, you know, a couple hours

Bekka Bjorke:

a couple days, couple of weeks, it no longer feels like

Bekka Bjorke:

inspiration and it feels like work and it feels like you know

Bekka Bjorke:

dragging your feet through the mud just to get something done.

Bekka Bjorke:

So I have to intentionally give myself breaks or other goals

Bekka Bjorke:

like not look at whatever I'm working at, and reinvigorate

Bekka Bjorke:

myself with something else, preferably something short, that

Bekka Bjorke:

doesn't, you know, really cause any problems to the flow of my

Bekka Bjorke:

business, but just giving myself something new to think about, so

Bekka Bjorke:

I can get that inspired feeling back, and then take that into

Bekka Bjorke:

whatever I'm not feeling motivated to do. Or even like

Bekka Bjorke:

starting something if there's like a new skill set, or

Bekka Bjorke:

something that I'd much rather be doing than whatever it is

Bekka Bjorke:

that I have to be doing. Starting it, getting that

Bekka Bjorke:

feeling kick started, and then giving myself a limit saying, I

Bekka Bjorke:

can't continue this, I can't keep chasing whatever this

Bekka Bjorke:

little micro dream is until I finish what I need to be doing.

Bekka Bjorke:

And then suddenly, there I am finishing it. And moving on to

Bekka Bjorke:

the next exciting thing.

Nicole York:

Becca, did you just tell us that we should have art

Nicole York:

fluffers?

Bekka Bjorke:

Yes, I'm gonna go yes.

Nicole York:

That's outstanding. No, I mean, but it's such a good

Nicole York:

point, though, really, because you're absolutely right. And I

Nicole York:

think this is one of the good things about having multiple

Nicole York:

creative hobbies, at least in my case is, if I'm starting to feel

Nicole York:

worn out, I can move and I can go do another thing. I can

Nicole York:

create a headpiece, or I can sew a costume, or I can make a foam

Nicole York:

thing, or I can repeat something I can do. Another thing that I

Nicole York:

love, that keeps that creative juice and keeps me in that zone

Nicole York:

where my my brain is still functioning on a creative level.

Nicole York:

And then coming back to the other thing later, definitely

Nicole York:

makes you feel like you're ready to get down to business. But I

Nicole York:

mean, I think you're absolutely right. And it's many of us have

Nicole York:

our have our one thing, we're a photographer, and that's it. And

Nicole York:

then when that goes away, all of a sudden, we have no identity.

Nicole York:

And so even from that perspective, it's so important

Nicole York:

to have many different ways to express yourself. So that if

Nicole York:

something were to happen, if your gear were to get stolen, or

Nicole York:

your business were to fail, or whatever it is, whatever thing

Nicole York:

may pull you away from that thing that you love, we need to

Nicole York:

have those those other things as well. Not only to keep us

Nicole York:

motivated, but just to be able to maintain our identities.

Bekka Bjorke:

I mean, even if it is just the one thing like from

Bekka Bjorke:

the photographer perspective, I suppose like, I'm sure I'm not

Bekka Bjorke:

alone in this feeling like you, you go to the shoot, you're on

Bekka Bjorke:

set, it's exciting, you're so excited, you get home, you look

Bekka Bjorke:

at the pictures, it's great, you call them and then you get to

Bekka Bjorke:

your editing, and you're like, I don't want to do this. I won't

Bekka Bjorke:

do this at all. And so like breaking that up, like maybe you

Bekka Bjorke:

have another set that you need to edit or maybe you want to

Bekka Bjorke:

start brainstorming some other like personal shoot or your next

Bekka Bjorke:

project or whatever that might be just to again, get those

Bekka Bjorke:

juices flowing. It's the same art form. But you're still kind

Bekka Bjorke:

of getting that next to the next hit right to get you back into

Bekka Bjorke:

the zone. So just giving yourself a break of some sort

Bekka Bjorke:

before coming back to what needs to get done.

Nicole York:

Yes, yes, yes. Okay, I love where this is

Nicole York:

going. What are some more things paper, paper Paper? How do we

Nicole York:

keep ourselves motivated? What are other things we can do?

Unknown:

So I find for me personally, I definitely get

Unknown:

those winter blues and I I get very unmotivated. And last year

Unknown:

that actually caused me to find CEU because I just needed

Unknown:

something different. I actually feel like an 11 year old boy

Unknown:

who's got ADHD that can't focus that can't think that cannot

Unknown:

just get the job done. And so for me to get motivated at it

Unknown:

need to find something that really that I really want to do

Unknown:

that I really want to create and I was noticing the other day so

Unknown:

I'm in Canada so of course and in Ontario and of course we are

Unknown:

now Toronto is on lockdown I'm outside of Toronto which means

Unknown:

that we're going to follow suit a very soon which means I'm

Unknown:

stuck with my you know homeschooling and everything

Unknown:

else so I can't even leave my house right now so but I'm

Unknown:

finding this desire to create and to make something which is

Unknown:

something I actually didn't have last year when I was going

Unknown:

through my my blues before I found su so for me I fail I

Unknown:

actually found a piece of jewelry that another artist had

Unknown:

made which is super super cool. So so I've kind of been working

Unknown:

the it's it's not down on paper yet because I just I'm trying to

Unknown:

work around everything else all the chaos that is happening. So

Unknown:

this piece of jewelry and I want to create this, this whole

Unknown:

fantasy thing which is not something that I do. I'm

Unknown:

portrait photographer that's what I do I shoot women family,

Unknown:

whatever. So to create something that is more fantasy and

Unknown:

artistic because of this one piece I think is keeping me more

Unknown:

motivated. So So I would say finding that one thing. That is

Unknown:

B is not what you normally do especially when you can't, can't

Unknown:

can't do it right. So finding something that's outside of your

Unknown:

wheelhouse and then turning it into art, which in itself can

Unknown:

become, you know, a great challenge. And I like challenges

Unknown:

personally. So I think that that would be my go to.

Nicole York:

Yeah, jump outside the box, right. I have found

Nicole York:

that works for me really well. Also Trish, just to even I think

Nicole York:

I've mentioned this before. But when we get to a place of

Nicole York:

mastery and a skill, we can start to get kind of

Nicole York:

lackadaisical because we know these things so well, now that

Nicole York:

they are done almost by habit, or rote. And sometimes, that is

Nicole York:

in itself can become unmotivated. Because that

Nicole York:

dopamine hit is gone, right? Like that exciting. The thing

Nicole York:

that was there before, when we learned or when we did a new

Nicole York:

thing, and it was like, Oh, my God, look what I've done, all of

Nicole York:

a sudden, that's gone. And so sometimes stepping outside of

Nicole York:

our box, genre wise, or media wise, or, you know, art form

Nicole York:

wise, or whatever it can really, really kick everything back into

Nicole York:

gear, because you get that, that rush again, and man who knows,

Nicole York:

you may have an entirely new thing, or you may have a new

Nicole York:

aspects of a thing you can take back to what you do. So I love

Nicole York:

that idea. Well, I

Unknown:

think for me, too, is that I, I honestly, I used to

Unknown:

love editing, I used to love sitting there creating, looking

Unknown:

at all these, you know how to how to increase color and depth

Unknown:

and everything else. And I, I love and then I found that I was

Unknown:

spending hours and hours editing and to the point where now I

Unknown:

just I cringe at it, I don't mind it, but I want to do one or

Unknown:

two photos that I really, really like. And that's it, I don't

Unknown:

want at it, find somebody else who can edit like me, and then

Unknown:

do it. And then this way I can stick to that creative thing.

Unknown:

Because when you're when you're editing and it's all very much

Unknown:

the same. You know, there's the one or two photo that you photos

Unknown:

that you get very excited about. And those are the ones that you

Unknown:

really, really want to do, like put your time into. And then

Unknown:

there's the rest of the photos. Which I don't know if that

Unknown:

sounds funny, or maybe I'm just bored of it, I don't know. But

Unknown:

for me, that's kind of where that goes. So finding that

Unknown:

artistic, I guess outlet for me makes things more interesting.

Unknown:

So when I do go in and have to edit, you know, a session, I'm

Unknown:

not editing the same portrait the same way, the same style.

Unknown:

And that was the one thing that I found with my business is that

Unknown:

I would go and I would edit and I'd be all creative and really

Unknown:

excited. And really like, wow, this is fabulous. And then the

Unknown:

client would say yeah, but I just wanted in color. And I was

Unknown:

like what, okay, spent all this time making these so incredibly

Unknown:

beautiful to me. But, uh, you know, but then you got to look

Unknown:

at the client's perspective as well. And they're like, No, I

Unknown:

just want the color. Like, wow. So it's, it's, I think, by

Unknown:

getting out of that wheelhouse, or going into two different

Unknown:

parts of your brain and creating, you create for your

Unknown:

you create for your clients what they need, but then you create

Unknown:

for you for what your soul needs, if that makes any sense.

Nicole York:

Yes, I connect to that so deeply. I am absolutely

Nicole York:

a hero shot person, I have no interest in editing anything

Nicole York:

beyond the stuff that excites me, which is why I stopped

Nicole York:

taking traditional clients. Because I'm not, I cannot do

Nicole York:

enough to make myself profitable by selling bulk images. It just

Nicole York:

makes me want to bang my head against the wall. And I could

Nicole York:

always outsource things, but I just don't even care to do that.

Nicole York:

So we either do it my way or no way. I'm so glad

Unknown:

I'm not the only one who like cannot stand doing

Unknown:

basic edits and clean edits and stuff. Is there something wrong

Unknown:

with me? Like, that's what I wonder, is there something wrong

Unknown:

with me that I just can't edit a photo? Like, here it is. It's

Unknown:

almost like hey, let me just do a point and shoot and make it

Unknown:

basic and plain. As if you know, I have no skill whatsoever. I'm

Unknown:

just going to shoot it and what you get is what you get. You

Unknown:

know, I think well, to a certain level, like cat I've been doing

Unknown:

this for like 10 years now. And you know, I it, it takes a lot

Unknown:

to be motivated and excited when you're doing the same mundane

Unknown:

thing. Like if I wanted to do that I would just go work in an

Unknown:

office doing the same thing every day for 40 hours a week,

Unknown:

right?

Nicole York:

Yep, I feel Yeah. Yeah, that's why I have the

Nicole York:

business models that I have. I apparently can never be

Nicole York:

satisfied. But I definitely I mean, I'm with you there. So, so

Nicole York:

far. If you're just joining us today, we've been talking about

Nicole York:

how we stay motivated, and we've got some really amazing subjects

Nicole York:

Questions from the artists on the panel today, everything from

Nicole York:

making sure we're moving our bodies, reconnecting to our why,

Nicole York:

looking at our habits, and seeing how those are playing

Nicole York:

into the way we feel, making sure that we're normalizing the

Nicole York:

fact that sometimes we're just not going to be that motivated.

Nicole York:

And there's nothing wrong with us. It's just the season we're

Nicole York:

in. But making sure that we look at that as a barometer. And we

Nicole York:

consider the fact that maybe something really does need to

Nicole York:

change, giving ourselves breaks, just breaking up the process a

Nicole York:

little bit and doing something else for a while. So we can get

Nicole York:

some of that motivation and that energy back and also trying

Nicole York:

something that is outside of our normal sphere, maybe a new

Nicole York:

genre, or a new medium, or something that we can learn a

Nicole York:

little bit and get excited about. So so far, we've got some

Nicole York:

fantastic suggestions. What else can we do y'all folks on the

Nicole York:

panel? We haven't heard from besar, Dustin yet. So what do we

Nicole York:

do, guys? How do we stay motivated?

Unknown:

Oh, yeah, I'm here, I've actually unmuted a couple

Unknown:

times that I glad that I'm glad that I re muted. Because I feel

Unknown:

like we have a lot of the same stuff kind of resonating through

Unknown:

quite a few of us, which is, which is awesome. Well, there's

Unknown:

a couple things that I do. For those of you who don't know, me,

Unknown:

I am a cosplay, slash composite photographer and CGI artists.

Unknown:

And it's, it's interesting, you know, I got into CGI, initially

Unknown:

is kind of an outlet from from graphic design and, and

Unknown:

designing album covers kind of what I would have considered at

Unknown:

the time sort of Basic Retouching. And, you know, it

Unknown:

worked, it carried me a long way, you know, it's kind of like

Unknown:

expanding that genre. Matt talked about, you know, kind of

Unknown:

rediscovering your why. And one of the things that I realized

Unknown:

that I don't do enough, and it may be partially from my

Unknown:

military background, I'm usually just go hard at it, get it done,

Unknown:

regardless of sacrifice and push forward. And I found here and in

Unknown:

recent years, like, that's just that's not right. It's not

Unknown:

enough, you know, like, my mental health needs help as

Unknown:

well. And so what I've been doing is, you know, whether it's

Unknown:

the middle of the night, you know, sometimes first thing in

Unknown:

the morning, maybe the last thing, you know, in the day, is

Unknown:

I literally pull our piano bench out, I sit on our piano bench, I

Unknown:

throw my air pods in and completely silence the world.

Unknown:

And I just listened to like, you know, whatever type of music I'm

Unknown:

feeling at the time, and I spend more time in my, my own head. So

Unknown:

part of that's rediscovering my why. And the other part of that

Unknown:

is just allowing myself to sit in silence from the rest of the

Unknown:

world, you know, whether it's my children, my wife, my, you know,

Unknown:

my work, I sure as heck get away from my computer. You know, and

Unknown:

in starting to work out again, you know, like already been

Unknown:

said, it's a huge thing to get up and move. It also spending

Unknown:

time kind of one on one time with me, I find to be really

Unknown:

important. Sometimes it's just like sitting there and looking

Unknown:

at myself in the mirror. And kind of figuring, you know, it's

Unknown:

like mentally figuring yourself out. But one of the other things

Unknown:

that I've been doing a lot lately is starting to, you know,

Unknown:

build with my hands. So I've got a little workshop in the garage,

Unknown:

it's quite cold here in Michigan at the moment. But I've got a

Unknown:

little workshop in the garage, and I just start building random

Unknown:

things, if that's, you know, taking apart Nerf guns and

Unknown:

putting them back together, kind of gluing and screwing different

Unknown:

pieces onto it and, and painting it up kind of like you know,

Unknown:

figuring maybe photo props or something. Like definitely doing

Unknown:

stuff that's getting me out of my, you know, immediate element

Unknown:

and the element that I'm in quite often. And I find that

Unknown:

that helps a lot, you know, it's very much of, you know, kind of

Unknown:

finding a new hobby, something else to do. When I do have to

Unknown:

sit at my computer like I am now I find places like this, the

Unknown:

artists work right you, you find places that kind of support you

Unknown:

as an artist, you as a professional. Having a community

Unknown:

and in a really good support system, I feel is key for

Unknown:

anybody that's in business, really anybody in life in

Unknown:

general. And it's something that I feel like a lot of people take

Unknown:

for granted. And I myself was one of them for many years. And

Unknown:

I'm finding that you know, it's it's a good thing to do so

Unknown:

finding places like this that you can hang out and talk I've

Unknown:

got an awesome group of artists on Discord that you know, we pop

Unknown:

into into group calls and chats quite often and you know, just

Unknown:

talk just kind of, you know, let our emotions out, we vent a

Unknown:

little bit kind of keep on track. And before you know it,

Unknown:

some of the work that I didn't want to do is already being

Unknown:

done. And I was able to sort of focus the brain and let my

Unknown:

muscle memory take over while I'm doing it. So that's my

Unknown:

piece.

Nicole York:

I love it. There's a lot of good stuff in there,

Nicole York:

man. And I can connect with almost everything that you said,

Nicole York:

I think at this point, it's probably clear. I've tried

Nicole York:

everything that exists. But I think so many artists had to be

Nicole York:

able to connect to so much of what has been said so far,

Nicole York:

because this is a rough road. And especially when you're doing

Nicole York:

a career that revolves around self expression, knowing

Nicole York:

yourself and being introspective and being able to ask yourself

Nicole York:

those questions be alone with yourself. These are pretty big

Nicole York:

deal. Have you found that you've come to any bigger realizations

Nicole York:

that way?

Unknown:

Can you guys still hear me? I feel like I just got there

Unknown:

we go. I feel like I just completely dropped out for like,

Unknown:

I heard the beginning of what you were saying. And then you

Unknown:

cut out?

Nicole York:

Oh, okay. No, I was just so have when those times

Nicole York:

when you've taken time for, you know, being alone with yourself

Nicole York:

and introspection and things like that. Have you come to any

Nicole York:

realizations during those times? Or does it just help you feel

Nicole York:

more centered so that you have the kind of mental energy to put

Nicole York:

to other places?

Unknown:

Oh, yeah. So it's, it's pretty much a, you know, helps

Unknown:

with feeling centered. You know, I, I talk quite often to my

Unknown:

artist, kind of crew about about energy, you know, and how we

Unknown:

wake up with certain levels of our battery full every day. And

Unknown:

I find that, you know, it's an empath. I spend so much time,

Unknown:

you know, feeling what others feel are helping others, you

Unknown:

know, in their their walks and their journeys, you know, as an

Unknown:

instructor, mentor, it's, it's very easy for me to get caught

Unknown:

up in what's going on and everything in the world around

Unknown:

me, and not focusing on the time that you know, that I need to

Unknown:

spend with myself to recharge the batteries. You know, in in

Unknown:

for me, it's quite often, very much. I don't know if it's

Unknown:

really a time that I, I have like any great aha moments. I

Unknown:

try to keep away from that and not not particularly think or

Unknown:

try to focus on letting these things happen. It just it really

Unknown:

just kind of refuels and then I can get back to what I'm doing.

Nicole York:

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. I know. For me,

Nicole York:

meditation is definitely the same thing. And it kind of

Nicole York:

sounds like what you're doing is almost an active meditation in

Nicole York:

that way. Yeah. And so go Google that folks, like, look up

Nicole York:

studies on meditation, you're gonna find so much good

Nicole York:

information, and so many reasons why it's worth giving it a try.

Nicole York:

And there doesn't have to be anything necessarily spiritually

Nicole York:

involved in that. Just even the practice of being present, and

Nicole York:

listening and feeling your breath and your body. There's a

Nicole York:

lot of really great things that can come out of that. So

Nicole York:

definitely, highly suggested. And now I have to put this on.

Nicole York:

Because you haven't said anything yet. So I'm dying to

Nicole York:

hear if you have anything that you do to keep yourself

Nicole York:

motivated.

Bassam Sabbagh:

Yes. Well, I haven't I haven't talked

Bassam Sabbagh:

because, you know, I don't have much to add about what I do on a

Bassam Sabbagh:

daily basis when I feel not not motivated. One of the you know,

Bassam Sabbagh:

there's one basic thing that I always that always ends up

Bassam Sabbagh:

getting me out of lack of motivation. And that is just

Bassam Sabbagh:

doing something and completing it. Okay. And that's already

Bassam Sabbagh:

been been said, I think I mentioned it, I it works all the

Bassam Sabbagh:

time. I have a whole bunch of things that I'm working on at

Bassam Sabbagh:

all times. They're never complete, they're always

Bassam Sabbagh:

ongoing. And what I find is just pick one of them get going, and

Bassam Sabbagh:

that and that works all the time. One thing I do want to

Bassam Sabbagh:

talk about, though, is is lack of motivation, not necessarily

Bassam Sabbagh:

on a daily basis, or in a phase or in a in a cyclical way or in

Bassam Sabbagh:

a seasonal Lake because I don't find I suffer from seasonal lack

Bassam Sabbagh:

of motivation. I don't get affected by weather and winter

Bassam Sabbagh:

and summer at least I don't perceive that I do. Maybe I do.

Bassam Sabbagh:

But I don't it's not even on my radar screen. So I never think

Bassam Sabbagh:

of seasons and months and periods and holidays and all

Bassam Sabbagh:

that they don't really come into play from a motivation.

Bassam Sabbagh:

perspective might might issue is more motivation over all right,

Bassam Sabbagh:

and, and all these great ideas and all the things that I want

Bassam Sabbagh:

to do and all the right things that I preach and I talk about

Bassam Sabbagh:

I'm actually apply. It's not that I'm not applying. But I

Bassam Sabbagh:

have so much more to do. And I'd like to do, and yet my

Bassam Sabbagh:

motivation level is at a point where I never get there. That's

Bassam Sabbagh:

how I feel. And I wonder if it's about being totally satisfied

Bassam Sabbagh:

with the status quo. And I wonder if it's about, you know,

Bassam Sabbagh:

good enough is good enough at this stage? And that's my

Bassam Sabbagh:

blockage. And I, I'm not getting out of that comfort zone,

Bassam Sabbagh:

because I actually like it. And I wonder if anybody can, is

Bassam Sabbagh:

there a link there? Is that is that motivation? Is it linked to

Bassam Sabbagh:

procrastinating that we've talked about, you know, do we

Bassam Sabbagh:

procrastinate, because we are happy with the status quo? So I

Bassam Sabbagh:

don't know it's a different subject, then, you know, day to

Bassam Sabbagh:

day, what do you do to motivate yourself versus overall? Are you

Bassam Sabbagh:

made it motivated to do all the great things you have in your

Bassam Sabbagh:

mind? So I don't know how anybody feels about that.

Nicole York:

I absolutely want to tackle that. But some but I

Nicole York:

want to give Robert a chance to speak. I kind of like to end on

Nicole York:

your question, because I have a few things I really would love

Nicole York:

to cover there. And make sure that we actually have that

Nicole York:

discussion. But I would love to hear what Robert has to say,

Nicole York:

before we get into that. Robert? Oh, maybe something happened,

Nicole York:

and he had to mute for a second. So hopefully he'll come back to

Nicole York:

us. Oh, there we go. Are you there?

Robert:

I am here.

Nicole York:

Oh, hello.

Unknown:

We missed the man Where you been?

Robert:

Listening. It's time for the old man to ramp a few

Robert:

minutes. I started this 30 years ago, we shot film. If you didn't

Robert:

shoot a medium format camera, you were trash. And then the

Robert:

digital world came in. And then and then we had to learn how to

Robert:

do our own retouching because they labs fired all the

Robert:

retouchers and hire digital technicians to do retouching and

Robert:

they had no idea of what art should look like. Or even a

Robert:

quality portrait. I love doing my retouching. I love doing

Robert:

everything. We went through a very bad time when 35 millimeter

Robert:

started doing autofocus. Everybody got a camera. And then

Robert:

they go, Oh God, this is too hard to quit. And then digital

Robert:

came in. And then everybody was like, jumped on the bandwagon

Robert:

and bought a little camera they could to do photography. And it

Robert:

was okay. And now I've been struggling for the last 20

Robert:

years, even though I went probably went digital long

Robert:

before I should have to keep up and stay ahead of the game. But

Robert:

then it just now and it's like, now it's really hard because now

Robert:

we have to do all this internet stuff to just try to stay afloat

Robert:

when everybody's brother got a camera. So it ships harder for I

Robert:

don't know, for me, maybe, maybe my friend when can step in and

Robert:

make me feel better. But talk to you later. Thanks for listening.

Nicole York:

You know, Robert, I think a lot of us really can

Nicole York:

identify with you even those of us who who didn't start in film

Nicole York:

back in the day. And I think it's one of those common things

Nicole York:

that we feel as photographers we're like God, the market is so

Nicole York:

saturated, and how do I keep up and now I have to do Instagram

Nicole York:

and Pinterest and Tik Tok and Facebook and all these things.

Nicole York:

And it's like the pressure and the different hats we have to

Nicole York:

wear all of the sudden we have to not just take photos and be

Nicole York:

editors, but we have to be marketers and bookkeepers and

Nicole York:

you know, PR people and videographers and all of this

Nicole York:

stuff. And it just is so much to handle. I mean it it really can

Nicole York:

be overwhelming. So I certainly I certainly know how you feel in

Nicole York:

that regard. And it can be really hard to keep up

Nicole York:

especially when you have younger people come in and they seem to

Nicole York:

have all of the energy for everything. And they understand

Nicole York:

how to use the platforms and I'm looking at all of these things

Nicole York:

going How do I post it? It can get really frustrating and

Nicole York:

overwhelming and lead to some of that lack of motivation that

Nicole York:

we've talked about before because it seems in some ways,

Nicole York:

it's like well, how do I even compete at this point? It makes

Nicole York:

you wonder if it's worth the struggle

Robert:

Well, part of it is also I don't like the new stuff. I

Robert:

don't like shooting into the sun. You know, I'm a classic

Robert:

portrait just and it's so hard to compete with everybody. And

Robert:

then they have, you know, all these little quick sessions

Robert:

where they just hand up images. And it's like, I like doing my

Robert:

retouching. And I like it my way, because it's, it's about

Robert:

what I do, you know, I don't do fantasy stuff, I have done some

Robert:

steampunk work. But my idea is just, I don't know, and I'm

Robert:

pretty computer literate, and that kind of stuff. But I just

Robert:

hate dealing with all this Facebook. And, and as you can

Robert:

see, I'm not very friendly. Sometimes I get a little

Robert:

boisterous. And I'm kind of set my own way. So really, really

Robert:

tough. But, yes.

Nicole York:

Yeah. And, you know, I think that I think that

Nicole York:

that can tie really well into the question that besom asked

Nicole York:

about this kind of level of overall motivation, because that

Nicole York:

comes from not just us, right. But everything is environment.

Nicole York:

So the circumstances we find ourselves in all of the things

Nicole York:

that are together. And just to reiterate, with some, I'm going

Nicole York:

to have you kind of ask that question one more time. And then

Nicole York:

we'll see if we can address that, because I think there's

Nicole York:

some really important questions in there.

Bassam Sabbagh:

Well, the question is, how do you deal

Bassam Sabbagh:

with what I perceive as lack of motivation? Overall, in what

Bassam Sabbagh:

you're trying to do? Not not in a seasonal or daily or, you

Bassam Sabbagh:

know, phased way? You know, is it you know, could it be related

Bassam Sabbagh:

to just you're happy with the status quo? Hope, cult status

Bassam Sabbagh:

quo? Sorry, are you or are, are there blockages that you're not

Bassam Sabbagh:

aware of that are holding you back? So how do you deal with

Bassam Sabbagh:

that? Does anybody? Does anybody experienced that? Does anybody

Bassam Sabbagh:

have clarity? Whether it is yes, absolutely. You're happy with

Bassam Sabbagh:

the status quo? It's good enough, why do something

Bassam Sabbagh:

different? It's that whole? I mean, there's many questions

Bassam Sabbagh:

there. But I hope it you know, it gives you a direction of

Bassam Sabbagh:

whether whether this questions are going,

Matt Stagliano:

you know, beside them, I think it's, it's really

Matt Stagliano:

important, because it does bring up so many questions. Basically,

Matt Stagliano:

you're asking, you know, is it okay to be content with the way

Matt Stagliano:

life is? And, you know, instead of questioning, like, Oh, my

Matt Stagliano:

God, I'm content, there must be something wrong, I have to have

Matt Stagliano:

more, I have to do more, I think, you know, that can be

Matt Stagliano:

toxic in and of itself. So if you ask yourself the question,

Matt Stagliano:

Am I just content? Am I happy? am I grateful for where I am?

Matt Stagliano:

Awesome. Maybe nothing needs to change. But if you're holding

Matt Stagliano:

yourself to a standard, that's somebody else's standard, or

Matt Stagliano:

you're trying to reach a goal, because you feel like you

Matt Stagliano:

should. Or if you're really just not content with where you are,

Matt Stagliano:

and you're struggling to find that motivation. I think it all

Matt Stagliano:

starts with asking those questions is, what is it that I

Matt Stagliano:

want? What am I doing out of this? Right? I know, for me,

Matt Stagliano:

there's this general lack of energy, this lack of motivation

Matt Stagliano:

overall, but I'm working through the question of, Am I just okay,

Matt Stagliano:

with where I am in life right now. And my whole life up to

Matt Stagliano:

this point has been on red line, because I'm trying to be a

Matt Stagliano:

perfectionist, and I'm trying to do so much and my idea of

Matt Stagliano:

success, is this? Or is it okay to just sit back for a second

Matt Stagliano:

and be grateful and be content? And I struggle with it? I don't

Matt Stagliano:

know. I don't know where I'm at. But that's the question that I'm

Matt Stagliano:

asking myself right now. And I think it really ties into, you

Matt Stagliano:

know, our, our perception of we need to be at this level in

Matt Stagliano:

order to be happy. And that's a, you know, a dangerous path for a

Matt Stagliano:

lot of people.

Bekka Bjorke:

Where, I mean, what, what's the difference

Bekka Bjorke:

here, then, between content and motivated? I mean, do we

Bekka Bjorke:

actually need to be motivated at all times?

Matt Stagliano:

That's exactly what I was getting at. Rebecca,

Matt Stagliano:

Becca, I keep calling you, Rebecca.

Bassam Sabbagh:

That's right. Yeah. But the disconnect is the

Bassam Sabbagh:

fact that he that I have, or we have all these aspirations and

Bassam Sabbagh:

plans and things in our head. I mean, I'm sure everybody does.

Bassam Sabbagh:

They don't go away. And as long as they're there, there's a

Bassam Sabbagh:

there's a counterbalance or non or lack of balance, which I'm

Bassam Sabbagh:

calling motivation today. Maybe it's something else. Right? So

Bassam Sabbagh:

is there a way to, I mean, if you get rid of those, or if you

Bassam Sabbagh:

if you if you reduce, or at least be more content with less

Bassam Sabbagh:

in terms of where I want to be in what I want to do and all

Bassam Sabbagh:

these ideas, if you eliminate all those, does that solve the

Bassam Sabbagh:

problem? Right? The problem is, I can't eliminate all those.

Bassam Sabbagh:

They're there. Right? And I feed them every day. And I and I, and

Bassam Sabbagh:

I'm, I'm hungry for information and I get information and it

Bassam Sabbagh:

adds to that stuff that I want to do and it in a way, it

Bassam Sabbagh:

motivates me. In a way it motivates me. So yeah, it is

Bassam Sabbagh:

doable. And I should do that. And I want to do it. And so it's

Bassam Sabbagh:

like a non ending spiral of, I would call it sometimes positive

Bassam Sabbagh:

spiral. And this is not a negative spiral.

Nicole York:

But but it doesn't resolve itself. Right. It

Nicole York:

doesn't

Bassam Sabbagh:

resolve itself. It's never ending. And maybe

Bassam Sabbagh:

that's life. I don't know. Maybe it'll just keep going. And it's

Bassam Sabbagh:

all good.

Nicole York:

Oh, I'm, first I have to say, I'm so glad you

Nicole York:

asked this question. But some because I feel it so much. I

Nicole York:

noticed that Erica came up. And she had her hand up earlier, and

Nicole York:

we couldn't hear from her. So I want to make sure I hear from

Nicole York:

you. But I really have some deep thoughts on this one. So I'm

Nicole York:

going to share those in a bit. Erica, what are your thoughts?

Erika:

Sorry, about earlier classic case of not closing my

Erika:

phone and hitting the button. So anyway, just on the last thing

Erika:

that besom was saying. I think that's why it is so important

Erika:

that you fall in love with the process. Because then you know

Erika:

that upward spiral is always inspiring, and you're enjoying

Erika:

yourself rather than, you know, feeling like you're not

Erika:

achieving, or you're not getting to where you're going you're

Erika:

enjoying where you are at the same time as moving upward.

Bassam Sabbagh:

Yeah, I think that is that is key. And maybe I

Bassam Sabbagh:

am enjoying the process. And that's what I mean by it's good

Bassam Sabbagh:

enough. Because as I go through it, I'm I'm content and I'm

Bassam Sabbagh:

motivated when I am doing it, and I and I get pleasure out of

Bassam Sabbagh:

of what I'm, you know, I get pleasure from accomplishing my

Bassam Sabbagh:

Y, which I do. I mean, whenever I do a photoshoot whenever I do

Bassam Sabbagh:

a client, I mean I do so maybe I am enjoying the process. And

Bassam Sabbagh:

it's just that disconnect that I'm talking about that that gap.

Bassam Sabbagh:

And I'm trying to say, is that related to lack of motivation?

Bassam Sabbagh:

Or is it something else?

Nicole York:

Okay, so I'm going to tackle this one now, because

Nicole York:

I'm excited. Alright, I think there are actually quite a few

Nicole York:

things going on in here. One of them is, of course, the social

Nicole York:

and societal expectations that we have, or that are that are

Nicole York:

kind of inherently thrust upon us for what success is and what

Nicole York:

we should want and the goals that we should have and where we

Nicole York:

should want to go. And if you're not that hard charger, if you

Nicole York:

are a person who literally is like, I'm just good, where I'm

Nicole York:

at right now, when you weigh that against what everybody's

Nicole York:

expectations are, and everyone thinks you should always be

Nicole York:

pushing and moving and growing. And you know, all of a sudden,

Nicole York:

then your happiness next to this weight of expectation makes you

Nicole York:

question, well, is this wrong? Then like, what should I should

Nicole York:

I want these other things? Or if I don't, there must be something

Nicole York:

wrong with me. Because literally everybody makes it sound like

Nicole York:

that's where we should be headed. And if I don't want to

Nicole York:

head there, if I'm cool where I'm at, then maybe I've got

Nicole York:

something wrong inside me. So that's certainly I think, can be

Nicole York:

a part of that question. The other part of it is making sure

Nicole York:

like Matt said earlier, understanding, what do we

Nicole York:

actually want? So being able to separate our personal goals and

Nicole York:

our personal aspirations from the expectations of society? Do

Nicole York:

I actually want to be a famous photographer? What would that

Nicole York:

look like? Right? Do does that the actual life I want to live?

Nicole York:

Do I want to not be able to show up to conventions because I get

Nicole York:

glommed by people who want things for me? Is that the life

Nicole York:

I want to live? So being able to really separate out our why, and

Nicole York:

our desires from the societal expectations or the group

Nicole York:

expectations of what success looks like or what we should

Nicole York:

want. And then also, if it is, if if we recognize that we

Nicole York:

cannot get rid of this innate desire for more, I think there

Nicole York:

are a couple things there. One, I believe you're right, in the

Nicole York:

fact that there is a desire for life to grow. That's just the

Nicole York:

kind of evolutionary thing we want more, we want bigger, we

Nicole York:

want growth, we want babies, we want resources. We can't not

Nicole York:

want those things, because that's the way that humanity

Nicole York:

expands itself. So part of it is that the other part of it is,

Nicole York:

maybe it really is something that you want for real and

Nicole York:

you've been able to clarify that with yourself. Then you have to

Nicole York:

recognize the fact that I know we've talked about this with

Nicole York:

atomic habits and comfort zones is that you're never going to

Nicole York:

run To the level of your goals, you're going to fall back to the

Nicole York:

level of your systems, your training, our training

Nicole York:

conditions us to be comfortable in our comfort zone, because

Nicole York:

that's where we're safe. And our brains wants us to be there,

Nicole York:

because that's where we're safe. And safety and continuing to

Nicole York:

live is one of the most important functions that our

Nicole York:

brain provides for us. And once we start to do things that break

Nicole York:

those habits and break those boundaries, there's a lot of

Nicole York:

discomfort involved in that, which is why it's so hard for us

Nicole York:

to build new habits, it takes real effort to build new habits

Nicole York:

and get them to stick because that means we have to completely

Nicole York:

break all of the normal standards of our day, all of our

Nicole York:

expectations, we have to change everything, and push into these

Nicole York:

new areas. And we have to do them often enough and regularly,

Nicole York:

so that they actually stick and become the new normal. And that

Nicole York:

is not easy to do. Which is why people seek out trainers, and

Nicole York:

mentors and coaches and people who can hold them accountable.

Nicole York:

Because for most of us, we will only make those changes when

Nicole York:

some outside force acts upon us, we won't make them out of our

Nicole York:

own volition because the urge to stay safe to stay safe and

Nicole York:

comfortable is greater than the urge to push forward. When it

Nicole York:

comes to the action, right? We still have that desire, because

Nicole York:

that's innate in humanity. But getting to act upon that

Nicole York:

actually requires some kind of force, which is why we've talked

Nicole York:

about the fact that inertia is the biggest thing we have to

Nicole York:

overcome. When it comes to moving forward, we have to have

Nicole York:

some type of motive force that pushes us into those things. So

Nicole York:

I recognize that I just said a whole lot of stuff that we could

Nicole York:

probably turn into several conversations all on their own.

Nicole York:

But the important thing to recognize there is that it is

Nicole York:

multifaceted question, the answer is yes.

Nicole York:

Depending on what your answer to those internal questions are,

Nicole York:

and if you can get to the heart of those things, and it becomes,

Nicole York:

yeah, I really do want these things, I just don't have the

Nicole York:

motivation to do them, my life is comfortable enough that

Nicole York:

there's no force acting on me, that would motivate me to take

Nicole York:

the steps that I need to take. That's when we start having to

Nicole York:

seek out things that will help us break that comfort zone,

Nicole York:

whether that is a person that comes in or a change of

Nicole York:

circumstances, or whatever, because habits are important for

Nicole York:

us remember that our brain is the most calorie hungry part of

Nicole York:

our body, it burns most of the calories that we use in a day.

Nicole York:

And so it wants to protect itself. And so it will build

Nicole York:

habits, and it will build comfort zones in order to, you

Nicole York:

know, limit the amount of calories it's spending in a day.

Nicole York:

So we have calories to do our other normal functions. If it

Nicole York:

can turn something into a habit, or a comfort zone, it will

Nicole York:

because we're alive and we're still functioning. So make this

Nicole York:

a habit, once it becomes a habit, we don't think about it

Nicole York:

anymore. And we we recreate that habit without consciously trying

Nicole York:

to do it, which is why they're so powerful. So there's a whole

Nicole York:

lot involved in that question, because I'm and I realized I

Nicole York:

just threw a crap ton of information out there. But it's

Nicole York:

I think it's a complex answer. And and I mean, the answer is

Nicole York:

yes. I hope that makes sense.

Bassam Sabbagh:

Absolutely. It is it is complex. And I you

Bassam Sabbagh:

know, I don't know, if it opens up a whole bunch of this, you

Bassam Sabbagh:

know, topics we can talk about, and some of them we've probably

Bassam Sabbagh:

covered in the past. But yeah, no, I mean, it does make a lot

Bassam Sabbagh:

of sense. And I don't know what else to say. It's just, I don't

Bassam Sabbagh:

know, I'd like to hear from others.

Nicole York:

Let's go folks, do you have any thoughts? I know

Nicole York:

we're at the end of our hour, but we got time for a couple

Nicole York:

more thoughts if you have them.

Nicole York:

We don't gotta that's fair, too. Well, this is certainly a

Nicole York:

conversation that we we can, you know, keep on the burner and

Nicole York:

continue to explore, because I do think that it's really

Nicole York:

interesting. And I'm sorry, if I, if I just threw up so much

Nicole York:

that it was overwhelming, or brain breaking. But there's just

Nicole York:

there's so many interesting potential conversations there.

Nicole York:

And so many areas that we can explore when it comes to the way

Nicole York:

that we function. And these these kind of built in or

Nicole York:

internalized systems that happen. And we feel maybe like

Nicole York:

we should be out of them. But why do we feel that way? And

Nicole York:

then exploring those and how it's related to our personal

Nicole York:

psychology versus our collective psychology. And it's just a

Nicole York:

really interesting question, but on our conversation today, it's

Nicole York:

time to start kind of pulling everything to a close as we

Nicole York:

recognize the fact that staying motivated as an artist as a

Nicole York:

business person in our growth as an artist and our growth as a

Nicole York:

business can be a really difficult prospect and I think

Nicole York:

The first step is for us to be okay with the fact that we're

Nicole York:

not always going to be supremely motivated or passionate.

Nicole York:

Sometimes we are going to go through seasons, where we're

Nicole York:

just not super excited to do our job. Or we're not super excited

Nicole York:

to do the next study that it's going to take so that we can

Nicole York:

start drawing eyeballs or hands or whatever it is, it's not

Nicole York:

always going to be fun, it's not always going to feel motivating,

Nicole York:

it's not always going to feel passionate, impassioned, and

Nicole York:

that's okay. We need to normalize the fact that those

Nicole York:

seasons are going to happen to us. And we don't need to feel

Nicole York:

bad or wrong, if we're in one of those places. But recognizing

Nicole York:

that a season is a season, which means it shouldn't last forever,

Nicole York:

and if it starts extending, and if it's making us unhappy, and

Nicole York:

if it is causing us problems, that we need to make sure that

Nicole York:

we look within ourselves, we take that time for

Nicole York:

introspection, we asked ourselves those questions. Are

Nicole York:

we still connected to our why our deep goal for doing this

Nicole York:

thing? Is it still bringing us joy? And is that still our goal,

Nicole York:

and if it is, do we need to change something about our

Nicole York:

approach about our daily habits, about our systems, that will

Nicole York:

help us recenter and refocus on that thing, we need to make sure

Nicole York:

that we're moving our bodies, we need to get out and walk or jump

Nicole York:

around or climb or walk our dogs or, you know, go to the gym or

Nicole York:

do jujitsu, or whatever it is that can get our body moving.

Nicole York:

That is really incredibly important for our motivation. We

Nicole York:

also want to take time for ourselves, to do that self care

Nicole York:

to have time for introspection and quiet time, we want to make

Nicole York:

sure that we have other passions as well, that we sometimes

Nicole York:

experiment outside of our comfort zone, whether that's

Nicole York:

genre or artistic medium, we want to make sure that we break

Nicole York:

things up sometimes that we give ourselves a break between one

Nicole York:

task and the next so that we have a chance to finish

Nicole York:

something else, and reset and re motivate ourselves.

Nicole York:

And having systems as Erica mentioned, having things to do

Nicole York:

that we love, every single day that we build our systems in

Nicole York:

such a way that we love the life that we're living, and sometimes

Nicole York:

just that on its own, will carry us through those phases where we

Nicole York:

feel less motivation. And we can still see that growth in that

Nicole York:

forward momentum. So a lot of fantastic things that we can do

Nicole York:

to keep ourselves motivated when we start flagging. And when we

Nicole York:

start feeling like it's just maybe it's not worth it to keep

Nicole York:

going at this, which also lends to the question, how do you know

Nicole York:

when it's time to stop? How do you know when it's time to quit,

Nicole York:

or time to change or try something new? And I think we'll

Nicole York:

talk about that tomorrow. Because I know many of us have

Nicole York:

seen our careers morph and change and merge into something

Nicole York:

new and sometimes stop entirely and move in a new direction. And

Nicole York:

that can be a really difficult thing to stomach. But that is a

Nicole York:

legitimate question we have to ask ourselves when we come up

Nicole York:

against this lack of motivation, particularly if it becomes long

Nicole York:

term, but there are so many things we can do. If you are

Nicole York:

doing these things, and they work for you share that in the

Nicole York:

Facebook group. If you have something else that you'd like

Nicole York:

to share that really helps you stay motivated or gets you out

Nicole York:

of a rut. When you find you're in one. We'd love to have you

Nicole York:

share that in the Facebook group as well. Also remember, there is

Nicole York:

a live poll in the Facebook group about potential topics of

Nicole York:

conversation, go and add yours to the list and vote on the ones

Nicole York:

you want to hear. That'll help out a lot and make sure that

Nicole York:

we're covering the topics that you care about. Big thanks to

Nicole York:

everybody who came and hung out with us today. We came up on the

Nicole York:

panel and shared your thoughts and your insights and your

Nicole York:

inspiration. So much appreciate having you up here. And

Nicole York:

hopefully everybody will join us tomorrow morning bright and

Nicole York:

early at 7am. Mountain Standard Time for the next morning walk

Nicole York:

with the artists Forge. And in the meantime, go make something

Nicole York:

amazing. We'll see you tomorrow.

Matt Stagliano:

Thanks again for listening to this live clubhouse

Matt Stagliano:

discussion moderated by all of us at the artist Forge. We hope

Matt Stagliano:

you found the information useful and that it helps you gain a

Matt Stagliano:

little bit of insight as to how you work on your craft. For more

Matt Stagliano:

episodes, please join us each weekday on clubhouse or visit

Matt Stagliano:

the artists forge.com Go make something incredible

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About the Podcast

Morning Walk with The Artist's Forge
How to Critique Art
Learn how mindset, creativity, and visual literacy will help you think like an artist so you can create work you love and build a career that matters; bridging the gap between technique and art.

About your host

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Nicole York